Ep. 263: me & my unethical organ sac

[00:00:04] Speaker A: Think of this as something of a sequel. Right? Think of this as something of a kind of a recap, an update of an earlier topic. But ah, man, sometimes doesn't it feel like you're just banging your head against a wall, but the wall is full of thumbtacks and your head is bleeding, but you can't stop banging your head against a wall. It's like looking at a car crash. It's like picking a fucking piece of skin at the side of your fingernail. You know what I mean? [00:00:34] Speaker B: Don't talk about that. [00:00:35] Speaker A: Like scratching something that you know is gonna form a scab. It's horrible. One of the things I can't stop fretting about is ah. And by ah, I mean rich people. [00:00:52] Speaker B: Okay? [00:00:53] Speaker A: Capacity at the worst possible times to just turn up the dial and invent to make it worse. [00:01:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:01:05] Speaker A: Does that make sense? [00:01:06] Speaker B: Do you know what I'm saying? Yes, absolutely. [00:01:09] Speaker A: Like when the planet is burning, let's invent NFTs and let's invent crypto and let's invent AI. [00:01:16] Speaker B: Right? Yeah. What can we do to just undo any possible, you know, forward motion? Yes. [00:01:23] Speaker A: How can we stack the scale? How can we put the fucking pressure on the pedal? How can we speed up the decline? [00:01:31] Speaker B: Right. [00:01:32] Speaker A: How can we make things. How can we make this worse? Yeah. In the name of increasing our wealth. Right. So long time listeners and I know you're out there and I, we see you and we love each and every God damn one of you. [00:01:52] Speaker B: It's true. [00:01:53] Speaker A: Might remember when I spoke some months back, it might even have been in 2025 about Calico Labs. Do you remember that? [00:02:03] Speaker B: Yeah, I think that was like a long time ago, wasn't it? [00:02:07] Speaker A: Maybe so, maybe so. Calico, full name, the California Life Company, Cale Cove. [00:02:13] Speaker B: Right? Right. [00:02:14] Speaker A: They are the kind of basement in house, undercover, under wraps. Longevity, immortality. R and D division of Alphabet. [00:02:32] Speaker B: Right? Yeah. [00:02:34] Speaker A: Remember those guys? [00:02:35] Speaker B: Yeah, right. I mean that, right, Google, right, Exactly. [00:02:40] Speaker A: They are the site of Google, which they don't really talk about much. [00:02:44] Speaker B: Right. [00:02:46] Speaker A: But they are, hey, the headlines say that they're focused on health, well being and longevity. [00:02:53] Speaker B: Do you want to know when you [00:02:54] Speaker A: talked about this, Mark, was it, how long ago was this? [00:02:58] Speaker B: April 5th, 2021. [00:03:02] Speaker A: Get the fuck out of here. Yes. [00:03:06] Speaker B: Five years almost, you know, to the day here. [00:03:10] Speaker A: Well, a lot has happened in. [00:03:11] Speaker B: A lot happened. All right. Yeah, let's update. If you're. If anyone is wondering and wants to go Back to part one of this, it's episode 31, how to maybe get away with murder. [00:03:21] Speaker A: 31. [00:03:24] Speaker B: Two digits. [00:03:25] Speaker A: Rookie numbers. Remember those days? [00:03:27] Speaker B: Rookie numbers. And we were like, wow, can't believe we're still doing this. This is crazy. [00:03:31] Speaker A: Ah, man. [00:03:33] Speaker B: All right, go on. [00:03:38] Speaker A: Anyway, since then, right, things have gone. Calico is still a thing, right? But they have. They've notched up at least one massive, massive failure. In January of last year, they developed and trialed a drug with a ridiculous name. Fosigotifator. F O S I G O T, I F A T O R. Fosigotafata, which they designed to slow down the progress of als. Right? [00:04:09] Speaker B: Oh, well, that sounds great. [00:04:11] Speaker A: What a great fucking lofty ambition. But it had no kind of impact versus placebo in slowing ALS down. None. [00:04:25] Speaker B: Cool. It's a Elizabeth Holmes situation. [00:04:28] Speaker A: So one of their pharmaceutical partners terminated their collaboration. Wasting over, you know, wasting a billion, of course. But they've pivoted since then, right? [00:04:40] Speaker B: Oh, no, love a pivot. They're selling shoes now. [00:04:45] Speaker A: No, no, no, no. They're still in the immortality business, okay? But now, rather than slowing down neurodegenerative disorders, they're now all about immortal, Increasing longevity. And they are blocking proteins, new drugs, mouse studies, all that good stuff. And they. At the cost of billions of dollars and, you know, however much covert research, the mice are living longer, okay? The mice are living not just longer, but better. [00:05:23] Speaker B: That's. That's a nice change from what normally happens to lab mice. [00:05:28] Speaker A: Well, yeah, I wouldn't like to even guess what happened to the mice afterwards. [00:05:34] Speaker B: Well, sure, yeah, sure, they're not pets, [00:05:38] Speaker A: but, but, but you might wonder if Calico and Alphabet is a kind of a fringe division, kind of rare kind of company. What if I told you they are not, and there are fucking so many massively funded, often super sketchy on the fringes of ethics companies out there doing to try and make rich people live forever. [00:06:17] Speaker B: I mean, this is so fascinating to me because obviously there's that one. Is it Brian Johnson? Is that his name? The one guy who like stole his kids semen or whatever. [00:06:25] Speaker A: I know, yeah, yeah. [00:06:26] Speaker B: You know, like whatever he was doing to try to, you know, he's like, oh, I'm the same as my 20 year old son or whatever. And, and obviously. Listen, I know, like it's a psychological thing with ego and just having a certain amount of money making you basically not a human anymore. [00:06:49] Speaker A: But like, beautifully put. Oh, hold that thought. Hold that fucking thought. [00:06:54] Speaker B: We'll get there. But just from like my perspective, right, like on, on a level, right, like we're all afraid to die. Right. Like, you know, that that's a normal thing since we are the animal that knows we're going to. And we don't know how. And it could be like, oh, easy peasy, or it could be nightmarish and we don't know. [00:07:16] Speaker A: And while I. [00:07:16] Speaker B: We're all. [00:07:17] Speaker A: While I continue to describe and to, to an extent define myself as death positive, right. I certainly. It isn't something that I'm comfortable with. [00:07:27] Speaker B: Right. You know, it's a massive unknown on many levels. And it means, you know, the end of everything that you love. Right. So to a degree you understand, like the idea of wanting to live forever or why, like on a religious level, you create a heaven and things like that, you know, you understand the impetus behind that. From a I live on the planet Earth in 2026 perspective. [00:07:52] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:07:53] Speaker B: The push for longevity without a push for fixing anything else is the craziest fucking thing. Why would you want to live forever? If you don't solve the climate change, if you don't solve health care, if you don't solve everything else going on, what are you gonna live to be 200 for? Don't get it. [00:08:18] Speaker A: Hold all of these thoughts, Brian. Yeah, hold them all. [00:08:21] Speaker B: All right. [00:08:22] Speaker A: While I talk to you about some of the fucking companies that are doing this shit. Please do what they are doing. And I don't think you're quite prepared for just how fucking shady this gets. [00:08:34] Speaker B: Okay? [00:08:35] Speaker A: Yeah, I don't think you're ready because I fucking wasn't. [00:08:39] Speaker B: We did do a story at Wisecrack on the, like, biohacking phenomenon. Rookies. Yeah. In. And just to say as you get into this that, like, it is again, it's just fascinating to me these people who are like, so disconnected from real world conditions. Rookies that spend all of their time trying to biohack. Right. Which is to find ways to optimize, which is the words they use, optimize yourself all the time. Where this is not. This is not living that they are doing. And again, why are you doing this? Why are you doing this? So hit me, Mark. I'm. I'm ready to hear about what the real. [00:09:22] Speaker A: I'll start by mangling some science, if I may. [00:09:26] Speaker B: All right, do it. [00:09:28] Speaker A: A lot of the science underpinning the efforts of these companies comes down to one or two techniques to try and postpone the inevitable and to try and extend healthy, worthwhile air quotes. Lifespan, Right? Sure. One of these is epigenetic reprogramming. [00:09:50] Speaker B: Okay. [00:09:52] Speaker A: Which is the technique of changing what gets turned on. What Genes get turned on in your DNA. [00:10:02] Speaker B: Okay. [00:10:04] Speaker A: So the genes that respond, they're responsible for skin aging and, you know, muscle plasticity or whatever, it's changing the way those, those kind of genes activate. So reprogramming your DNA to kind of switch off the aging mechanism. [00:10:22] Speaker B: Right? Yeah. [00:10:24] Speaker A: Again, I apologize so much to Eileen and to anybody with letters after their name who might be listening to this, but it's all about winding back, I guess, the biological awareness of your cells without changing what those cells do. Right. [00:10:43] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:44] Speaker A: The science of finding where the aging response happens in your DNA and turning it off or changing it. [00:10:49] Speaker B: Right. [00:10:50] Speaker A: The second approach a lot of these are using is autophagy, which is the, the, the study of, you know, how your cells will break down and clean themselves and will decay and almost, you know, like when you've got a cut or a scab or something like that, the phages will go to that and heal it and whatever. Autophagy is a process which declines as you age. [00:11:22] Speaker B: So which is like, that's got to be like the kind of thing behind why eventually, if we live long enough, we all get cancer, right? [00:11:28] Speaker A: Cancer. [00:11:29] Speaker B: Cell breakdown, yes. [00:11:31] Speaker A: The process of autophagy, it, it, it means damage builds up, it contributes to, like you said, cancer, metabolic diseases, neurodegeneration. [00:11:43] Speaker B: Right. [00:11:43] Speaker A: And revitalizing that, keeping that response active. That's a big focus of some of these companies. Right. But again, it goes further out than that, of course. So let me just run through some of these and listen. There's a prize at stake here, right? I'm going to talk to you about Altos Laboratories. Altos Labs, right. They have bases around the world. You can find them in Japan, you can find them in California, you can find them in Cambridge. Here in the good old UK they've been around since 2022 with a 3 billion kind of initial funding run. Take a guess. Pick a rich guy. Who do you reckon is a chief, big time investor in Aldos Labs? Pick a rich guy. [00:12:37] Speaker B: Bezos. [00:12:38] Speaker A: Bingo. [00:12:39] Speaker B: First fucking time, all right. [00:12:43] Speaker A: First fucking crack. Jeff Bezos is a big investor alongside a couple of a Nobel laureate, a couple of Russians. [00:12:51] Speaker B: Sure. [00:12:51] Speaker A: And the usual suspects. The usual suspects. What possible interest could a cadre of wealthy pricks like this have in living forever? This is the question I'm scratching my bald, aging head here. What if I told you that their approach is AI driven? So they're using AI models. Yeah. To guide human cells back towards more youthful states. Like I said, with epigenetic reprogramming, turning back the clock without Changing the core purpose of the cell. [00:13:34] Speaker B: Right. [00:13:36] Speaker A: Obviously. People work for Altos Labs. They say that, hey, we're. We're in the realms where we could extend human lifespan by up to 50 years. [00:13:46] Speaker B: Great. [00:13:47] Speaker A: They're in early stages of human safety testing. Right. They've been testing their on people Saf since August of last. [00:13:58] Speaker B: Well, they've been doing that with neuralink too. Didn't that just like immediately kill the guy it was used on? It's. Have you seen the. The show upload? [00:14:09] Speaker A: I've seen the movie. [00:14:10] Speaker B: Completely different. [00:14:13] Speaker A: The movie's great. [00:14:14] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:14:14] Speaker A: Or is the movie called Upgrade? [00:14:16] Speaker B: Upgrade you're thinking of? Yeah, that's a different thing. Upload is a great show. It's on prime about. Basically people can choose to upload their consciousness into like an afterlife type scenario that's like all digital or whatever. And depending on how rich you are, you get like a nicer afterlife or like a more basic afterlife. [00:14:43] Speaker A: Certain Black mirror did this exact concept. [00:14:46] Speaker B: But one when they like initially like. So of course like that's all good and well, but like the rich people don't really want to like be in an afterlife. They want to be back. Right. So they try to put the consciousness back into humans and as soon as they start to do this, just immediately just like someone's like head just explodes immediately. And that's the thing you kind of hope happens with this. [00:15:11] Speaker A: I hope I'm there or I hope I live to see. Yeah. [00:15:15] Speaker B: Bezos attempt to download and he goes full scanners. [00:15:20] Speaker A: Starts bleeding out of his fucking eyes. An asshole just collapses in a heap of organs. Yes, but that's happening. That's happening right now. They're rich, they're well funded, they're testing their shit. No, they're not in the kind of regulatory kind of stage yet. In the profit generating stage yet. Pure research. [00:15:40] Speaker B: So what are they. Do you know what exact like what parts of this they're testing? [00:15:45] Speaker A: I do not. [00:15:46] Speaker B: Okay. I mean I'm sure they keep that pretty. [00:15:50] Speaker A: That's. That's a common theme with all of these companies, right? [00:15:53] Speaker B: Very like we're definitely doing it. We just can't tell you what we're doing. [00:15:59] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What if I. What if I. What if I told you about Retro Biosciences, Right? [00:16:07] Speaker B: Okay. [00:16:08] Speaker A: Based out of California. Pretty on the nose name Retro Biosciences. [00:16:14] Speaker B: Pick another rich guy out of California. [00:16:17] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:16:18] Speaker B: Ooh, is it Elon? [00:16:20] Speaker A: No, the other one. [00:16:22] Speaker B: The other one. [00:16:24] Speaker A: One of the other ones. [00:16:25] Speaker B: It's like, is there like a specific [00:16:27] Speaker A: other One, he's very much rich guy du jour. Oh. [00:16:33] Speaker B: Oh, I don't know. Who is it? [00:16:35] Speaker A: Sam Altman. [00:16:36] Speaker B: Oh, Sam Altman, of course. I, I like, don't take Sam Altman seriously. Even though he's like, like the most destructive force in the entire world right now. It's just like my brain is like, no, not that nerd. Absolutely not. [00:16:54] Speaker A: While this isn't by any means his company, sure, he funded it to the tune of like some 180 million. After reading a paper from the founder showing that he could, you know, extend mice by about with their blood, Altman Bang put in a couple hundred million to seed it. They have explicitly stated, we want to add 10 healthy years to the human lifespan. They're doing the stem cell reprogramming, they're doing the autophagy and the plasma therapeutics. So blood medicine, all of that stuff simultaneously and again in human testing. In 2025, they dosed their very first human patient with the goal of targeting Alzheimer's. Oh, isn't this interesting? In 2025, they've also struck a deal with. Let me think, which company? Anyone? Anyone? OpenAI to use GPT to redesign the proteins of stem cells. [00:18:00] Speaker B: Again, this is just. People's cells are going to explode and. Fine. I'm sorry, I just. And I know I'm just gonna keep being on this rant throughout this because this is just what keeps coming, coming to me as you keep talking about this. Add 10 healthy years to the human lifespan. Before this started, we were talking about, like, the American healthcare system. We've both been watching the Pit, which we'll talk about, you know, in a bit, but. [00:18:23] Speaker A: Yep, yep, yep, yep, yep. [00:18:25] Speaker B: If you want to add 10 healthy years to the American lifespan. Fund health care Fund health care. You know, if these guys paid their taxes, yes, we would add 10, 20, 30 healthy years to people's lifespan. [00:18:44] Speaker A: The quiet part is adding 10 healthy years to the wealth, to rich people's [00:18:48] Speaker B: lifespans who already have access to the health care that will save them no matter what. [00:18:53] Speaker A: Funded healthy rich years. [00:18:56] Speaker B: Right. [00:18:56] Speaker A: To the millionaire human lifespan. [00:18:58] Speaker B: Yeah, it's like. It's exactly that. It's the, the quiet part, right? It's like all of this sounds really good if you're a fucking rube. If you, like, think that this will trickle down to us in any way. Sure. This all sounds great. They're working on Alzheimer's. Wow, that's amazing. [00:19:16] Speaker A: They're like, oh, wonderful, right? [00:19:19] Speaker B: Like, my husband's got the gene for Alzheimer's. I would love to see what they're gonna do for him. Not for him. You know, like, it's just everything you say. And this is what we were talking about before too. It's enraging because we know what the solution to adding healthy years to people is. And it's not this. [00:19:41] Speaker A: It's not this. It isn't this. Yeah, but the. The. Just the list of names goes on. There's Life Biosciences, based out of Boston. Again, Epigenetic reprogramming. Clinical human trials at the start of this year. New Limit. This one's interesting. A company by the name of New Limit. Kind of on the nose, bit of a shit name. [00:20:02] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean that one definitely does sound like a shoe brand. [00:20:06] Speaker A: Co founded by the CEO of Coinbase, Brian Armstrong. [00:20:11] Speaker B: Is that one? Is that one of those. That's a. That's a coin, right? Coin. Or I mean like. Like a bitcoin. [00:20:17] Speaker A: Coinbase is a bitcoin exchange, yes? [00:20:19] Speaker B: Yeah. Okay. [00:20:20] Speaker A: Crypto exchange. [00:20:21] Speaker B: Crypto exchange, that's the word I was. I, I. You can tell I do everything I can to just not know about any of these things. When like three months ago, everyone started referring to AI as agents, I was like, I don't know why everyone is suddenly talking about agents everywhere and what that means. I just refuse to know things about any of this. [00:20:44] Speaker A: Maybe that is the only sane response in the face of all of this. [00:20:48] Speaker B: Don't make me know this. There is no need for me to [00:20:52] Speaker A: know what Jack of all Graves Corrigan. Hiding is not an option here. [00:20:58] Speaker B: Not an option? No. Right, so go on. Coinbase. [00:21:02] Speaker A: Coinbase. Once again, epigenetic reprogramming. Just in the last. Just in 2024. They scared up 130mil just to try and understand what controls that aging kind of signal in DNA. But this is the one I really want to go in on deep here. Right, okay. You want to talk about an on the nose name for a fucking, you know, longevity company? Let's go to Singapore. Let's talk about the company called and I shit you not, Immortal Dragons. [00:21:47] Speaker B: Sounds like an offense. We would be launch on Iran. [00:21:52] Speaker A: Yeah, Operation Immortal Dragons. It's been a great success. Oh, I do an excellent trump. You're gonna find out later on. I also do an excellent Dana from the Pit. [00:22:04] Speaker B: Oh, interesting. [00:22:06] Speaker A: I'm based in South 22. [00:22:11] Speaker B: Wow. Like she's here in the room with us. [00:22:16] Speaker A: Get your shit together. [00:22:19] Speaker B: That actually isn't bad so bad, is it? [00:22:21] Speaker A: I've. I've done that every episode. [00:22:26] Speaker B: What was. [00:22:27] Speaker A: Go home, get some Rest. [00:22:31] Speaker B: Oh, she had such a good line on one of the episodes recently. I wish I could remember it to make you. [00:22:35] Speaker A: We'll. We'll get it. We'll get it. [00:22:36] Speaker B: We'll get it. [00:22:37] Speaker A: We'll get it. We'll get it. [00:22:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:38] Speaker A: Immortal dragons. Right? Because this is where it gets super. It gets so fun. You don't have to imagine these immortal dragons. That's. Imagine dragons. [00:22:48] Speaker B: Oh, Imagine dragons. [00:22:49] Speaker A: These are Immortal dragons. [00:22:51] Speaker B: Okay. [00:22:51] Speaker A: They have they. And these are Immortal Dragons are the least secretive of all of these companies, right? They are out there. They are loud and proud. They have. [00:22:59] Speaker B: They've got a. Singapore. [00:23:01] Speaker A: Yeah, well, yeah, but they've. They've got a poster line. They've got a tagline, right? Immortal dragons are going to, quote, make death optional, end quote. [00:23:12] Speaker B: Oh. I mean, if this were a movie. Hell yeah. [00:23:19] Speaker A: It's not. [00:23:20] Speaker B: It's not. No. [00:23:22] Speaker A: So I'll start off by talking to you about the founder of Immortal Dragons. A guy originally from China, a guy by the name of Boyang Wang. Okay, okay, stop it. [00:23:32] Speaker B: What. What did I do now? What did I. All I did was for a moment think, that sounds like Bowen Yang from snl. [00:23:41] Speaker A: Okay, fine. Boyang Wang. Mock him for plenty of things, but not his name. [00:23:46] Speaker B: No name is fine. [00:23:48] Speaker A: Good. In his early years, he suffered an episode of anaphylactic shock. Right? And that set him on a pathway of going into preventative medicine. He lost consciousness for an hour and made him consider a world where if we could make death optional. Right, sure. Now this guy is giving interviews to Wired. This guy is just throwing around the craziest quotes. And his company are investing in startups that are doing real Umbrella Corporation shit. [00:24:28] Speaker B: Oh, boy. [00:24:29] Speaker A: Right. Because unlike the other candidates that I've spoken about there, Immortal Dragons are very much into the field of replacement of body parts and regeneration of body parts. Oh, xenotransplantation. [00:24:48] Speaker B: Okay. [00:24:50] Speaker A: Bioprinting, tissue replacements, organ replacement. [00:24:55] Speaker B: This is getting very out of every sci fi horror at this point. [00:25:00] Speaker A: What if I said. What if I fucking said whole body replacement? [00:25:05] Speaker B: Incredible. It just reminds me of when we were talking about like head transplants back in the day and that I hadn't like, considered that, like, the body is the part you're transplanting, not the not well, head. [00:25:18] Speaker A: It's a fascinating question, isn't it? Much for a start, right? Wang is. He has tried. He has tested out some of his company's experimental gene therapies on himself. He has injected his own. His own experimental gene therapy in his own body. Right? He's quoted. The gene therapy is a personal attempt, but it. This reflects our risk profile. This reflects our support for the cause. He's trying shit out on himself as he goes. [00:25:51] Speaker B: Has he ever seen a movie? [00:25:54] Speaker A: Well, exactly. Has he ever seen the substance? Has he. You know, Right. He's tried something on himself called Follistatin therapy. It's a gene therapy to increase muscle mass and to slow down muscular decline through age, mostly completely unregulated. It's called fucking running your ass around the block and fucking lifting some in. [00:26:16] Speaker B: We have actually invented that. Yeah, you get a couple dumbbells, you know, and that's how you keep your muscle going. [00:26:25] Speaker A: But here's the thing. Immortal Dragons have invested in a startup known as R3Bio. [00:26:36] Speaker B: Kim. [00:26:36] Speaker A: Right. This is a startup that has been around for a few years, operating very, very quietly. But earlier this year, in March this year, they started to give a few interviews. They gave an interview to MIT Technology Review, which got widely quoted. They showed up in Wired with a plan. They have announced funding to develop. And this is a quote from somebody in R3 bio. To develop non sentient organ sacs. Right? [00:27:16] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:27:17] Speaker A: You with me? [00:27:18] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:27:20] Speaker A: They are proposing firstly organ sacs. So they've done this in mice, developed mice with inbuilt hydronencephaly, no brains. [00:27:34] Speaker B: Okay. [00:27:35] Speaker A: Right. [00:27:36] Speaker B: Mm. [00:27:36] Speaker A: Which they were able to nurture and keep alive to harvest for organs that. [00:27:45] Speaker B: Isn't that like the island or whatever? Like we have a whole bunch of people that we. [00:27:51] Speaker A: This is an idea that I personally fucking came up with when I was a fucking edgelord dickhead like 15, 20 years ago. I came up with this idea. Well, can we just. [00:28:01] Speaker B: I think that movie's about that old at this point, but, you know. Yeah, it's like a. It's a sci fi idea. Oh, we just make a spare that we can take, you know, organs from. [00:28:13] Speaker A: You know what I mean by hydraencephaly? Yes. [00:28:17] Speaker B: Well, isn't that. Is that not water on the brain? [00:28:20] Speaker A: That is a condition where a baby is born with almost a complete absence of hemispheres of the brain. [00:28:30] Speaker B: Okay. [00:28:32] Speaker A: However, with care, that condition isn't fatal. And you know you can live with that, right? You know, you can't engage, you can't speak, you've got. Your motor function is fucked. You can't do really anything purposeful air quotes. But it's not in and of itself fatal. The bodily systems remain alive. So our three are actively pursuing how to intentionally produce such a condition in a cloned body. [00:29:12] Speaker B: Yet it's literally that movie it's exactly what. That's in Wired. [00:29:19] Speaker A: Right? In Wired. And Jesus Christ. There are people who have been to pitches from R3, bio from the. From the founder, a guy by the name of John Schlendorn. He has shown investors scans, medical scans of children with practically empty skulls as a proof of concept that humans can almost live without. [00:29:44] Speaker B: But would you do that to one of these children? Right? Like, I think the first step in thinking about this is going, do we think that child is not a person? [00:29:57] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:29:58] Speaker B: Well, because if the answer this is no, you know, then like, all right, party on. But if you think that child is a person, this is. Then this is a real hitch in your. In your plan here. [00:30:11] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:30:12] Speaker B: Like, it doesn't matter if, you know, they. You can grow something akin to this. [00:30:18] Speaker A: But there's this. There's no kind of. They aren't. Or they. They've rolled back since the Wired article in March. But Wang himself, Bo Yang Wang himself quoted as having said, they produced, like I said, mice without full brains. Wang has said they were imperfections, but the resulting mice survived. They grew up. And to me, that's a pretty strong [00:30:42] Speaker B: experiment, except for the part where if that was a person, you would then use them for parts. [00:30:52] Speaker A: Listen to this for a quote. Listen to this for a quote from Bo Yang Wang. [00:30:56] Speaker B: Oh, my God. [00:30:57] Speaker A: We think replacement is probably better than repair when it comes to treating diseases or regulating the aging process. If we can create an insentient headless bodyoid for humans, that would be a great source of organs. [00:31:14] Speaker B: This is just an outcropping of, like here. So, you know, when I was saying before, like he said bodyoid, we know that, like, from a psychological perspective, there basically becomes a point where rich people stop being human. Right? And this grows out of, like, this idea of, like, you know, Elon Musk has really popularized the idea of people. People as NPCs, right. [00:31:37] Speaker A: As, oh, I hate it. [00:31:39] Speaker B: Non player characters, people in video games. [00:31:42] Speaker A: That term once. And I absolutely unloaded on him. [00:31:45] Speaker B: And that shows you how, like. Yeah. How widespread that is. Like, your kids aren't. And yet, you know, they encounter this kind of language. And it's like, if you have in your mind this idea of already, there is a class of people who, like, do not have feelings or agency or, you know, anything real about them. They're just sort of there to be, like, send you on your next quest or to serve you or whatever the case may be. Then the next step from that is then we can also just use bodies. [00:32:20] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:32:21] Speaker B: For our own purposes. [00:32:23] Speaker A: That's exactly it. [00:32:24] Speaker B: There's just simply. [00:32:26] Speaker A: Here's where the kind of argument hinges, right. R3 on its website, on its homepage. We do not create the types of large scale structures that are imagined in the media. They've rolled the back and one of their founders, a please, please don't come in here. [00:32:49] Speaker B: We're really. We're not doing the things we said we're doing. [00:32:51] Speaker A: To quote Alice Gilman, she rejects. Where's the quote? Here it is. To quote Thought Catalog.com Gilman objects to calling R3's creations brainless. Quote. It's not missing anything because we designed it to only have the things we want. Oh, it's not a person because we. It's not missing a brain. It was never designed to have a brain. [00:33:23] Speaker B: I just, I mean it's obviously this is why, you know, people like Americans fund things in other countries and things like that instead of here's, you know, the lacks are ethical rules around these kinds of things in experimentation. And it's just a way of avoiding dealing with the ethical questions here where it's like, I just, you know, from. If they're growing these mice. Right. And the mice are like functioning. [00:33:54] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:33:55] Speaker B: And doing shit or whatever. All that says is like, we need to think more about like what consciousness is or whatever and what role the brain and the rest of it has in this. Not that like, oh, it's fine if it doesn't have a brain. It's just meat that runs around. It does. Like that's not meet the how that works. [00:34:16] Speaker A: It's not human. It's a. I mean, he used the phrase. I think it was organ sack. Is that what he called? [00:34:23] Speaker B: Yeah, I believe that was what you said earlier was organ sack a body oid. Like you can use all the euphemisms you want for this, but what you've done is created a person. Yeah, yeah. Like this is, you know it. And that's like the like the annoying thing about rich people curiosity, right. Is like they see it as like, oh, I can invent a thing to exploit instead of holy. I've stumbled upon like what does this mean for human consciousness? Or whatever if something can exist without a brain, without a head or things like that. Right. Like if you turn me into my benefit. Yeah. Like that's. Well, and that's what I mean is it's like what questions that should raise for us is all kinds of really interesting scientific thoughts. Right. And instead they go, meh, how do I. How do I exploit this you know, it's the questions that they ask are rooted in exploitation at every turn instead of any form of intellectual or scientific curiosity. [00:35:28] Speaker A: And the human, whatever the fuck you want to call them, the, the art, [00:35:35] Speaker B: I call it a human. [00:35:37] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Creations that R3 are proposing to create would have to be carried via surrogacy, right? Would have to be birthed. You don't just make this in a petri dish from pluripotent cells. This is something that needs a process of gestation to happen. You would have to got like an [00:36:00] Speaker B: immortan Joe situation going on. [00:36:02] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly, exactly, exactly, exactly. [00:36:05] Speaker B: Yeah. Just like there's simply no way that's not another form of exploitation. Nobody becomes, you know, just like a birthing cow because like, they're in a great place in their, in their lives. You know, I have tons of money. Everything's going great for me. I'm going to birth tons of bodyoids for a living. Like that's not a. That's not a thing. It's like every level of it is going to require more and more exploitation. And hopefully, you know, this. I have a hard time believing they can do this in the first place. Like the. The leap between you can have a little bit of brain and function and you can have no brain and function. Seems like a really big leap. Sleep well? [00:36:52] Speaker A: Again, to quote Thought catalog, right? From people who have been at presentations from R3 and seen patent filings. I'm quoting from Thought catalog. The patent filings include images of the results. Mice born without a complete brain, without faces, without limbs, without a complete brain. [00:37:15] Speaker B: Not without a brain. [00:37:15] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Without a complete brain, but without faces or limbs. One patent illustration is described as resembling a fleshy duffel bag connected to life support tubes. [00:37:26] Speaker B: Jesus Christ. [00:37:28] Speaker A: Literally, meat in a tank. Organs that you can cut off and install as needed. Like a fucking modular device or a phone or, you know, repair the fucking, you know, the transistor in your tv. Just fucking swap out a lung from the meat sack. [00:37:47] Speaker B: Yeah. And again, the base question of this is, if a child is born like this, can I go to that child and hack off an arm if I need it? You know, can I go and harvest their liver if I need it? If the answer to that question is no, then we can't be making things like that, right? Like if we're patterning this off of real disabled humans. All you're doing is creating disabled humans that you can harvest things from. That is. [00:38:22] Speaker A: That is exactly it. You've hit the nail on the head. [00:38:25] Speaker B: It's incredible, like just the lack of humanity in these people to think that you can, you know, just bespoke craft a body from which we can pull things. It's so dystopian and, like, so clearly not how humanity works. [00:38:49] Speaker A: So, you know, for me, what this does is really illustrates how far wealth is prepared to go to sustain itself. [00:39:00] Speaker B: Right. [00:39:00] Speaker A: Yeah, Right. And it is a fringe kind of domino of inshittification in the services that we use every day. When that has been milked for all it has, for all it can, for all it can produce, when the fossil fuels are running out, when the global and economic and political situation is pushed to its apex. This is what capitalism then goes on to try and do. [00:39:28] Speaker B: Yeah, and it's just, it's incredible because, I mean, I'm beating a dead horse here, but it's just, we know obviously life expectancy until recently was going up in rich countries. Right. That's not fascinating. [00:39:46] Speaker A: Fascinatingly, just today, it has been all over the news cycle here in the UK that healthy life expectancy in Britain has gone backwards by two years. [00:39:56] Speaker B: And I think in the us, same has happened as well. And, you know, we're getting at younger ages, diseases like colon cancer and heart disease and things like that. You know, there's all these kinds of things that are happening that is reducing life expectancy. But we know under the right conditions that life expectancy, you know, with healthcare and things like that, it expands, you know, countries that have better social safety nets and things like that, it expands fans. And so, you know, when it comes down to it, there is no reason that, like, humans, aside from like the obvious, like genetic predispositions towards things, couldn't live to be 120 or whatever with proper health care. But that's not what they want. [00:40:48] Speaker A: It's the one. It's one of the things I, I adore about Star Trek. It's that vision that if you just do it right, if you build society around human potential. Exactly. Not what you can milk from people. We can colonize the stars and we can work together and meet people with wrinkly foreheads and just, you know, have all sorts of cool fun and then Wesley will off with the travel. It'll be great. [00:41:14] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:41:15] Speaker A: Where is my holiday timeline that we're in? [00:41:17] Speaker B: No, we're not the timeline that we're in. And it's so myopic, I think, you know, just the. Like I was saying in the beginning, like, what are you living to be? However, you know, an extra 10, extra 50 years for if the world that you've created is one that is unlivable. You know, and to your point about the sort of Star Trek future, I mean, that's what is so nice about it, is like, you know, this collective collectivist society is one in which everyone can live and, you know, the air is clean and we have, you know, made it so that everyone has what they need. They, they don't necessarily have more than they need, but they have what they need and they can live comfortably and everything is great. And what these people are doing is just increasingly making this world one in which they cannot live. And then they're like, we'll just go to Mars or whatever. [00:42:12] Speaker A: But I mean, if you push, push that idea, I don't necessarily agree, I don't, I don't agree that they're making a world in which we cannot live. They're making a world in which we, you and I, cannot live. Cannot afford to live. [00:42:27] Speaker B: What happens when they run out of people to exploit? [00:42:30] Speaker A: You know what happens growing organ sacks is it is [00:42:37] Speaker B: who will make their TVs, who will make their spaceships? You know, like that's, that's what I mean is it's so myopic in that. Like they think the human resources will last forever, but they won't if everyone is sick. You know, if you're the only ones who are healthy, you do not have anyone who can build this shit for you anymore. You don't have anyone to buy the things that make you rich. Like the end game of this is them in a bunker somewhere having to fend for themselves, you know, as the climate collapses and things like that, because they're not immune to hurricanes and earthquakes and all that stuff either. [00:43:18] Speaker A: You know, I had the resources to grow a clone organ sack of myself with just like an empty wet space where its brain would be right. I would simply spoon with it and watch TV shows. I wouldn't, I would not use it. I would simply binge be your little squishmallow. I would lie its big wet head on my lap and stroke itself patchy hair and we would watch shows together and chore, you know, I've changed my mind. [00:43:51] Speaker B: I'm for it. [00:43:52] Speaker A: Me and my meat sack. Let me quote directly from my notes, if I may. [00:43:58] Speaker B: Yes, please do. [00:44:00] Speaker A: Look at these nerds. Oh, mise en scene. [00:44:03] Speaker B: I don't think anyone has ever said mise en scene in such a horny way before. [00:44:07] Speaker A: The way I whispered the word sex. [00:44:08] Speaker B: Cannibal received worst comes to worst. Mark, I'm willing to guillotine you for science. [00:44:13] Speaker A: Thank you. That's really, really sweet. It's cold outside, but my pancreas is talking to me. I'm fucking. I'm going to let it. [00:44:19] Speaker B: You know how I feel about that, Mark. [00:44:22] Speaker A: I think you feel great about it. After that, we'll start with a little reality check. Good day, listeners, or good evening, wherever you are, whenever you are. We're grateful you've joined us. Sorry to have to do this. [00:44:38] Speaker B: I wanna thank you. [00:44:42] Speaker A: You can, but let's just check in. Let's just. Let's just touch base with the facts here. The world around us dying, you dying, your plans, your ambitions, your achievements, fleeting and pointless. The future doesn't exist. The only thing that you can do is arm yourself with thick layers of dark, self aware humor and comfort yourself in the knowledge that you were warned. And you see it happening around you and you're tuned in, you're locked in and you're dosed up on that jack of all graves fucking neurotoxin. [00:45:26] Speaker B: Do you like my dinosaur sticker? [00:45:32] Speaker A: Yes, I do. [00:45:33] Speaker B: It's a T. Rex and it says, I am hungry. [00:45:38] Speaker A: T. Rexes be hungry. [00:45:41] Speaker B: I think I might have gotten it in Korea, but I don't know. I have a box of stickers that I keep a lot of which I use for joag mailers, things like that. But some of them I like to keep myself like this T. Rex or my little Hawaii volcanoes on Joag melech erupting volcano. [00:45:59] Speaker A: I found your mailer from the Vatican in my work bag. [00:46:04] Speaker B: Ah. I asked you if you got that and you were like, I don't know what you're talking about. [00:46:08] Speaker A: Yeah, I found it. It's. It was in my work bag. I found it. [00:46:11] Speaker B: You just like on your way out the door and you just tossed it in your bag or something? [00:46:14] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was at the bottom of my work bag and it's completely fucking pristine. I opened it up and it's beautiful. It's beautiful. This beautiful lace representation of a skeletal figure and it's right now on our notice board under a magnet. [00:46:29] Speaker B: Oh, I'm so glad because I had. I bought one of those for myself and every time I see it, I'm like, I really wish that had gotten a mark. It's really cool. It was from when we went to the. What do you call the catacombs in Rome. [00:46:43] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:46:44] Speaker B: And it was like this specific because like one of the catacombs we went to, like didn't actually have any like bones in it except for like One that they kept on display just to be like, this is what bones look like. But this one was like really metal and just like there was a room called like the Room of Pelvises. And it was just like art made from pelvises. It's like super intense. [00:47:08] Speaker A: Right. Linking back to that opening. Right. Look at all the fucking art and beauty there is, to be frank, in death. [00:47:15] Speaker B: And this is what is so fascinating about, like, there's a couple different, like, groups of like, religious groups in Rome that are like, specifically or like in Italy that are very, like, fixated on death. And like, it's very. The way that they approach it is so hands on. It's like a very, like, you want to see this. Like, they turn bodies literally into art for you to go and look at. And it's like death positivity on steroids. Like every single day. They want you to look at this and see this. I would be comfortable with this. [00:47:53] Speaker A: Delighted by the post on our discord from our longtime listener and dearly beloved friend Hannah Cope, who saw a cool looking grave built like a pyramid and she laid a joag T shirt on his face and shared a photo with us. [00:48:09] Speaker B: That's what we're talking about. Yes. [00:48:11] Speaker A: Death can be just. It's. It's not. Can be. It is built into the deal of being human. It is part of the deal. [00:48:21] Speaker B: Yep. [00:48:22] Speaker A: And all the organ sacks and all the funding and all the idiocy and denial in the world isn't going to Change that. It's Mr. Burns telling Smithers to get into the Spruce goose. That's all this is, you know? [00:48:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:48:38] Speaker A: I said get in. I love that [00:48:42] Speaker B: there's like so a lot of. I think this speaks to the fact that you ever heard people say that everyone on blue sky is 38, which I think, you know, it's. It feels like it needs to increase because I was like 38 when people started saying this, so it was more like 40. But as a result, like, everybody on Blue sky is an elder millennial or Gen X and they're all autistic. And so there's like a very strong fandom of the Simpsons on Blue Sky. And, you know, I lived by the Simpsons when I was younger, obviously, and [00:49:21] Speaker A: until Joe Agate taught me everything I know about America. [00:49:25] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. And I think that's true for a lot of people around the world. And it used to be like, when I got married and. And probably for the next, like, decade after that on tv, right before Jeopardy. Was an hour of the Simpsons, just Simpsons Reruns. Right. Every single day. Six and six. 30 Simpsons reruns. And so it was like every day while I made dinner, I would watch the Simpsons. And so, you know, we all kind of have like our frame of ref. Like our things we know from the Simpsons. But it's also been on for 37 years now. And there's a lot that I don't know of it. And so a thing that I constantly am facing on blue sky is that people put up like Simpsons memes with like the caption and like a Simpsons font. And I never know whether it is a quote. Like, I don't know if this has spawned its own meme subculture. I don't know if I just don't know the reference because it's an episode that has happened within the past 15 years. [00:50:29] Speaker A: It. Yeah, it's. It's. I can't think of any other cultural property that is so responsible for my world view or up to a point, at least. [00:50:41] Speaker B: Yeah, of course. [00:50:41] Speaker A: Kind of my. My 30s. [00:50:43] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:50:44] Speaker A: As the Simpsons. [00:50:45] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, it's foundational, you know, gave us a lot of perspective on things that, you know, I think is still relevant in a lot of ways. And like I said. Yeah. I think for people around the world, it's often. Like when I was in Korea, there was like tons of Simpsons stuff. There's. When I was in South Africa, there was Simpsons stuff everywhere. It really is like how people get to know America. Or it was. I don't know if that's still the case. [00:51:12] Speaker A: So we have a few matters to discuss here. [00:51:16] Speaker B: Oh, boy. Speaking of America. [00:51:20] Speaker A: Yes. A few items that I'd like to table, if I may. If I could just bring us water. How would you. What is your second amendment, Corrigan? Can I ask you that? [00:51:33] Speaker B: What is our second amendment? [00:51:35] Speaker A: Nice. And look it up if you need to. I'd like chapter and verse. I would like you to direct. [00:51:39] Speaker B: Oh, you want like word for word what it is? [00:51:41] Speaker A: Amendment to the constitution of the United States of America. [00:51:48] Speaker B: Okay. The. This is all right. A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state. The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. [00:52:02] Speaker A: It's guns. It's the gun amendment. [00:52:05] Speaker B: Yes. [00:52:07] Speaker A: One of the first things I ever asked you was, do you want a gun? Lots of people do. When I was over there, one of the. One of the things I was most looking forward to was the opportunity to pack some heat and shoot some lead. And I did. And it was thrilling. Thrilling. [00:52:25] Speaker B: Not my cup of tea. But you. You had a great time. [00:52:28] Speaker A: Oh, it was great. I seem to remember I was quite good at it, but I was also. [00:52:32] Speaker B: You were high. [00:52:33] Speaker A: High, yes. Yeah. Right. [00:52:38] Speaker B: So, yeah, I have the. The thing in my car, so we can give it a look the next time you. [00:52:44] Speaker A: I. What I. What I think I achieved was a tight spread. [00:52:48] Speaker B: Yeah, it was like. Yeah, right. You were all in kind of the same vicinity of the target. [00:52:55] Speaker A: Very central mass, very proud. He's going down. So why then are you so fucking utterly incapable of killing one bloke? [00:53:05] Speaker B: Can I say. And listen, FBI agents or CIA agents or whoever who are listening in, this is not me condoning it or saying this is a plan I would make. But just. But I know. But here's what's crazy to me, right? Because I didn't know anything about, like. So the White House Correspondents Dinner, obviously, is this stupid fucking dinner that they do every year, and the, you know, the President comes and people roast him and the press is celebrated and all that kind of stuff. You know, from one time in your car where we were listening to some radio show that I do not like, when people who should be adversarial towards each other are friendly. You were surprised by this because it was like, you know, there was something about Conservative and Liberal MPs, like, hanging out together and getting a drink and blah, blah, blah. And I was like, fuck that noise. They should not be doing that. If your job is to be the opposite of these, like, racist assholes or whatever, what are you doing at the pub with them? [00:54:08] Speaker A: You know, it's like discovering kayfabe in wrestling when you're a kid. It's like realizing that, yeah, you know, wait a minute. Just get the same hotel or get the same car. [00:54:18] Speaker B: Yeah, right. They're all on the same team, as it turns out. I do not like this. And. And the White House Correspondents Dinner is an example of that. These people should not be hobnobbing with each other under any circumstances. It's their job to not be friendly with these people. [00:54:35] Speaker A: So for the Brits, who might be in the same position as I am, what is the point. Purpose of the White House Correspondence dinner? What is it for? Is it a fundraising event? Is it. [00:54:45] Speaker B: No, it's just a celebration of journalists, which. [00:54:50] Speaker A: By them. For them, with them. [00:54:52] Speaker B: I mean, I guess it's put on by the White House or whatever. It's people who cover the White House. And. And when you ask what its purpose is, I mean, that's exactly it, Right? Like, what's why would we do this? To make it so that they're friendly with each other and then they don't want to expose the President. Right. Like the implicit sort of relationship that this creates between the political people in charge and the journalists who are supposed to be impartially covering them and criticizing them and things like that. I mean, it's corrupt on its face. You know, there's no reason these people should be interacting with each other outside of stories. It makes it so that there is a conflict of interest. And that's on purpose, in my opinion. But all that to say what I didn't know about this is that they hold it in a hotel. Right. It's not at the White House or anything like that. It's in a hotel where people are staying. So there's, like, the bottom floor where they're doing this whole thing, and then there's, like, floors above it where regular people are paying money to stay in this hotel. And those don't have the same security as that bottom floor. So the people who go through, I mean, will from now on. Well, here's what I'm saying. So this guy goes and he decides to do the Naruto run through the lobby and just try to, like, run in and do a shooting or whatever, which was a bad plan. It was not a good plan that this guy made. He is lucky that they didn't shoot him immediately in that lobby. [00:56:40] Speaker A: Yeah, crazy. [00:56:43] Speaker B: Go. Go ahead. [00:56:44] Speaker A: Well, no, you'd imagine that he would be fucking dead before he hit the ground. [00:56:48] Speaker B: Very shocking that this guy is still alive, but also that they do this in a hotel where people can be above them and is insane to me, because what if someone just brought a fucking bomb? Yeah, sure, just leave it in your room. Go blow this place up. You've got Designated Survivor on your hands. [00:57:09] Speaker A: Very pleasing to learn that it's the very same hotel where Reagan failed to get assassinated. [00:57:16] Speaker B: Oh, is it? [00:57:18] Speaker A: Yes, indeed. By all means, look that up. But I'm certain I've heard from a few sources that it is the same Hilton, the same venue where someone took a shot at Reagan. [00:57:27] Speaker B: Can I tell you the. I went to the Reagan Museum with Kristen and Brianne, and it is fascinating because I spent time working in the Nixon Library. So every president has a library, and it's like, where they keep all of their records. It's, you know, they have, ooh, this was his car. This was what his daughter wore to her wedding, things like that. So in the Nixon Library, there is like, a big section dedicated to watergate you just, like, can't not talk about that. Right? Or so it would appear. Reagan's library does not acknowledge that the man ever did anything wrong in his entire career. And every time there is something. Yeah, right. Straight up. And every time there's something that, like, clearly was wrong, it will say, like, now, Reagan didn't want to do this, but his advisors forced him to, blah, blah, blah, blah. And you're like, what the. [00:58:27] Speaker A: Well, that's the Trump weirdest. That's the defense Trump always points out when he spouts some. I was just told. [00:58:32] Speaker B: I was told. [00:58:33] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:58:34] Speaker B: But the weirdest thing about the Reagan Museum is that there's one point where you're like, just, like, watching a little video or whatever, you know, blah, blah, blah. And then there's a curtain, and you have to pass through here. This is not like a. You know, it's not a curtain that's there to block you from seeing something. It's a thing. It's a thoroughfare. You go through this curtain and it just plays the assassination attempt on a tv. Someone did die. You are seeing the murder of someone. No warning. There's no, like, hey, when you go through this curtain, you're going to watch a man get shot dead or anything like that. You just walk through a curtain and there's this video right straight up. [00:59:17] Speaker A: Like, hey, you talk about Blue sky having a Simpsons fandom. [00:59:21] Speaker B: Blue sky has a fucking. [00:59:24] Speaker A: I've seen a lot of people with [00:59:26] Speaker B: our budget pics all the time. It is. It's fascinating. [00:59:30] Speaker A: It is a great piece of F footage. [00:59:33] Speaker B: But, yes, I did not realize this was the same place, but that is. When I think of Reagan almost getting assassinated, I just think of walking through that curtain and being like, oh, I just watched a murder. [00:59:44] Speaker A: Would it surprise you to learn. And I'm not checking. I'm not Googling. You can look at my fucking hands right now. Would it surprise you to learn that I think I can name every American president that has been assassinated? [00:59:57] Speaker B: Oh, please do. [00:59:59] Speaker A: Right. Okay. The risk of making a fool of myself. [01:00:02] Speaker B: There's gonna be a couple. These are. There are a couple that are kind of difficult here. [01:00:05] Speaker A: So the risk of making a fool of myself. Lincoln. [01:00:08] Speaker B: Yep. [01:00:10] Speaker A: McKinley. [01:00:12] Speaker B: Yes. [01:00:14] Speaker A: Garfield. [01:00:16] Speaker B: Yes. [01:00:18] Speaker A: Kennedy. [01:00:19] Speaker B: Yes. [01:00:20] Speaker A: I think that's it. [01:00:21] Speaker B: Yeah. I am so impressed that you got McKinley. [01:00:27] Speaker A: Yes, mate. [01:00:29] Speaker B: And I can vouch. He is not. He's not looking at anything right now. Just named those. That's an interesting party trick there, Mark. [01:00:37] Speaker A: Mm. [01:00:37] Speaker B: Why do you know this? [01:00:39] Speaker A: I don't know. [01:00:40] Speaker B: Do I Know, it's the thing, you know? [01:00:42] Speaker A: Yeah. It's just something. Something that I have Learned during my 40s. [01:00:45] Speaker B: Now do the assassins. [01:00:48] Speaker A: Okay. John Wolf Booth. [01:00:50] Speaker B: Nice. [01:00:52] Speaker A: Nah, that's it. That's all I got. Oh, Lee Harvey Oswald. [01:00:55] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, obviously. Yep. You got. McKinley was assassinated by Leo Sholgosh. Okay. I'm not sure if that's his first name, but Sholgos. His last name. Garfield by. What the fuck's his name? Charles Guiteau. [01:01:14] Speaker A: I have heard that name. [01:01:15] Speaker B: Yes. And then you got the other ones, right? Did I miss anybody there? Those were the only two you were missing. Right. [01:01:20] Speaker A: Okay. But you like that, don't you? That's something you impress. [01:01:22] Speaker B: I do. That's a good little. It's a good little trick. It's a good one. But yeah. So I don't know why. I mean, so that's my take is it's just the plan on its own was a bad plan when there was like a very easy way to do this. But it's really interesting. This is our first Blue sky assassin. He was on Blue sky, game developer. [01:01:49] Speaker A: Also he's got a game up on Steam or did have. [01:01:51] Speaker B: Oh, and he's a teacher, but he's not a leftist, which is very funny because, you know, immediately the big boogeyman for the Democrats right now is Hasan Piker. I don't know why. I mean, I do know why. They don't want people to be leftist, so they've. They've decided to use him as the big boogeyman. But, you know, immediately it was like, oh, see, this is what happens when you get those Hasan Piker types. You know, blah, blah, blah, blah, indoctrinating people. And this guy hated Hasan Piker and was like a full centrist. Like, he's really into like Will Stancil, who everyone in Blue sky fucking hates. And like is just like your straight, you know, center of the road liberal Maddow fan. You know, He's a joint November 2024 blue skyer, which is when Rachel Maddow told everybody to join. So when you see like a really bad liberal centrist opinion on there, if you have the little tag on, it's like up joined November 2024. [01:02:54] Speaker A: I see. [01:02:54] Speaker B: Yep. Of course. So that's fascinating. Also maybe part of like, I saw something that was saying that, like, I think it was Ken Klippenstein put it up. That was like, he was like very anti gun. So I see this may contribute to why he could not get anything done here. [01:03:13] Speaker A: Yeah, couldn't fucking Stick the landing. [01:03:15] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. It's like he got that wild hair, but he did not know how to. Like, he was not trained. You know, he had no idea what he was doing. He was just gonna run in there and, you know, hope it worked out. [01:03:30] Speaker A: But this is the third, isn't it? [01:03:33] Speaker B: At least. I mean, I think the thing is with presidents, like, there's always a bunch of, like, attempts, you know? So, yeah, there's this one. There was the guy who allegedly shot him in the ear, even though he has no damage to his ear. [01:03:48] Speaker A: Now this. So. All right, so this is interesting to me. Let me just pull on that for a little. So you don't believe the account, then, of the shooting? [01:03:56] Speaker B: It's not that. What I don't believe about it. [01:03:59] Speaker A: Long legs. I think I'd seen long legs, and I can't. [01:04:01] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, yeah. [01:04:06] Speaker A: The. [01:04:06] Speaker B: I don't believe he was injured from the gunshot. That's what I don't believe. Not necessarily that. Like, I'm not full conspiracy theorist. Like, it was planned or whatever. Like, these people are idiots. There's no way that that's what happened. But I think he got, like, you know, scraped in the scuffle or whatever and had a cut. I don't think a bullet hit him at all. [01:04:24] Speaker A: So you don't. So you're not saying that crack. There was a bullet. The president goes down to the ground amongst all the Secret Service agents. They smear like they. [01:04:32] Speaker B: Yeah, quick note. [01:04:34] Speaker A: You do believe that he was injured in this. [01:04:35] Speaker B: They killed again. A guy was killed. Someone was killed in that shooting. A bystander was killed. So, no, I don't mean that in a conspiracy theorist way. I mean in that, like, I think he just got, like, a little scratch in the scuffle of being tackled to the ground by his, you know, Secret Service people, and then was like, oh, I got shot. Like, that's. That was not from a gun. You'd be missing a chunk of your. Or at least have a scar. It wouldn't completely heal up if you were shot. Come on, buddy. So I don't want. I'm not trying to spread conspiracy theories here anywhere. I think, you know, it's just ineptitude that people keep being able to get this close to the President. [01:05:18] Speaker A: Well, yeah. I mean, and I'm not trying to get us shut down or you arrested. [01:05:23] Speaker B: Right. [01:05:24] Speaker A: Anything like that. [01:05:25] Speaker B: I don't want my global entry taken away. That's most important. [01:05:28] Speaker A: Honestly, it makes me optimistic because it feels to me as though every attempt. Give it six months and things cool down and somebody can find another opening and have another crack. Where there's been three, there'll be four, and, you know, better luck next time. [01:05:44] Speaker B: His health's gonna get him. That's really what it comes down to. [01:05:49] Speaker A: Maybe he's plugged into the fucking organ sack cartel. Maybe. [01:05:52] Speaker B: I mean, I mean, functionally, all rich people are, aren't they? [01:05:57] Speaker A: That's true. [01:05:58] Speaker B: That's true. When it comes to the treatment that they get for the things that happen to them. Like that man is in such terrible health and nevertheless he persists. Like, that man, if he were not wealthy, he would have been dead a decade ago. But they're keeping him alive however they need to. [01:06:19] Speaker A: I've seen a quote somewhere from Vladimir Putin, who has mentioned to another world leader that quoted as saying, well, you can live forever now. They can simply grow your new organs. There's, there's a, there's, there's a, there's a plug in at very high levels of power into this kind of shit. [01:06:37] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, my thing when it comes to, like, conspiracy in general is that, like, it's. You just don't need it because all of this stuff is so clearly. [01:06:51] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:06:52] Speaker B: Out there, you know, like, conspiracy means you have all sorts of people keeping secrets and, you know, things like that, which is just not like a thing that exists. But when it comes to, like, the stuff that they're doing, like, just look at the news, like, it's in there all the time. [01:07:13] Speaker A: There's a, there's a full fucking article on BBC.co.uk about this. Organ transplants for immortality. Might Xi and Putin be onto something? A translator speaking in Mandarin on behalf of Vladimir Putin told Xi how human organs can be repeatedly transplanted so that one can get younger and younger and might even be able to stave off old age indefinitely. Those guys know about these companies? Those guys know about these, you know, fringe bioscience companies? [01:07:41] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. And I don't know, I think, Yeah, I don't know how much these guys are ever fully going to be able to do. I mean, I think there are probably limitations to the human body when it comes down to it, and people will continue to spend their millions and billions trying to figure out how to, like, make the human body not work like a human body, but I don't know. I just don't know how possible this stuff is without fundamentally changing the experience of being alive. You know what I mean? [01:08:21] Speaker A: Well, it's the ship of Theseus, isn't it? [01:08:23] Speaker B: It is, right? Well, yeah, but the Ship of Theseus still floats. And I don't know that humans do, you know, put us back together. What is actually left? I don't know. [01:08:37] Speaker A: Beautifully put. I'll stop. I'll stop fixating on it now. [01:08:43] Speaker B: I mean, we'll come back around to it, you know, that's five years later, what we. [01:08:47] Speaker A: You know we will and you know we will, listeners. See you in half a decade. Mark, when I say, a couple of weeks ago, I think I spoke about this. [01:08:58] Speaker B: I know when you said that, I was like, is this something different than I'm thinking of? Because this was, like, a really long time. Has no meaning. [01:09:10] Speaker A: None. [01:09:11] Speaker B: Mark, just as a side note, what do you. What do you think of Joanna Paige? [01:09:20] Speaker A: Just let me just look up who that is. [01:09:22] Speaker B: Oh, okay. So you don't have, like a. She's one of your people. [01:09:26] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. I do not particularly care for her. I mean, I don't know her. I don't particularly care, like. [01:09:31] Speaker B: You mean you don't have, like, strong feelings? [01:09:34] Speaker A: I. I'm neither here nor there. I don't. I don't like Gavin and Stacy one fucking bit. [01:09:40] Speaker B: Yeah, I think that's reasonable. [01:09:41] Speaker A: Gavin and Stacey is a barometer for whether the person you're talking to is a simpleton. [01:09:48] Speaker B: You know what, listen, we all have our shows that we watch that, like, you know, sometimes you turn off your brain and you just. You just do it there. There are good people out there who, for some reason, watch Big Bang Theory, is what it is. [01:10:02] Speaker A: My organ sack would enjoy Gavin and Stacy if I ever wanted to pacify it. If it was, like, twitching, having, like, a nervous episode, I would stroke, put [01:10:10] Speaker B: on a little Gavin, Stacy and just [01:10:12] Speaker A: put on a little bit of James Corden and Joanna Page. [01:10:15] Speaker B: Yeah, my first. [01:10:16] Speaker A: I mean, coo at me. [01:10:19] Speaker B: Gavin and Stacy, obviously, is not a thing here, so my, like, real frame of reference for her was love, actually, which she's a delight in. But she's on this season of Taskmaster and she is so much fun. I ask you about her just because she's Welsh. I, you know, thought maybe she might have crossed your radar a little more when you lived in Wales earlier. [01:10:44] Speaker A: You don't know you've done it, but you've just fucking triggered the most irritating stereotype. Right. Fucking hell. [01:10:54] Speaker B: And I noticed seeing people on the television. [01:10:57] Speaker A: No, no, I know this wasn't intentional. Right. But all too fucking often. And any Welsh expats here will relate to this. I'm certain the second you mention you're from Wales, someone will pipe up One of a few things. They need to say, oh, I got a cousin who lives in Wales. Do you know him? [01:11:14] Speaker B: Right, right. [01:11:16] Speaker A: Or they'll ask you, oh, can you say the fucking long place? Beginning with Llanva and. [01:11:20] Speaker B: Yeah, but I didn't mean do you know her? I meant she's been on your television. [01:11:25] Speaker A: But you've. You. You're in very. You're in yellow card territory there, right? [01:11:30] Speaker B: No, that's like being like, she been [01:11:31] Speaker A: in Wales, where you're from. Is she famous? [01:11:35] Speaker B: Oh, you're from the United States. Have you ever heard of Tom Cruise? Like, you know, like, she's a very famous Welsh actress and you're from Wales. So it would stand to reason she's. She's a Welsh. Not that you would like her, but that you've heard of her. [01:11:50] Speaker A: I know you didn't mean it, but you've drifted into. [01:11:53] Speaker B: I have not. This is. This is projection, is what that is. You have a hang up and you interpret it. [01:12:02] Speaker A: Do you like to. [01:12:04] Speaker B: Did you not own a television in Wales? Is that what you're telling me? In our, in our, in our area in Wales, we did not have televisions, so I'm not familiar with any Welsh [01:12:14] Speaker A: celebrities, whether intentional or otherwise. [01:12:17] Speaker B: No, this is projection. This is on you. I have drifted into nothing. There's a Welsh woman who is on television. You're from New York. Do you know? Have you seen this person who is a New York celebrity? Yes, probably. Like, that's normal to see people who are from your region of the world. Anyway, I digress. She's on Taskmaster and so I was listening to the Taskmaster podcast and she is on this week's episode of it and she is just like, this is like if ADHD were like a human being. And it's so like, I feel very seen watching her on this show because the way that she thinks through things, I think you would feel very seen by it too. It's just like her, like, getting very overwhelmed by, like, too many, like, stimuli and somehow stumbling upon the answer to something, not knowing how she did it, but just like pulling something from the mess of stimuli that are attacking her at any given moment and just, oh, man, she's just an absolute delight to, to watch. So, you know, if you and your family ever get around to watching Taskmaster, she is a pleasure on that. [01:13:35] Speaker A: Thank you. I'll keep that in mind. And maybe next time I go home to Wales, maybe I'll see her. [01:13:41] Speaker B: You're in the streets, you know what I mean? [01:13:43] Speaker A: Maybe we'll Bump. [01:13:44] Speaker B: You will. [01:13:44] Speaker A: You're gonna. For the village toilet. [01:13:46] Speaker B: Yeah. And then you're gonna be like, [01:13:51] Speaker A: I will never tell you. [01:13:52] Speaker B: Yeah, you can't tell me now if you ever encounter her, because you're like, God damn it, we do all know each other. [01:14:01] Speaker A: Let's see. Okay, so what else to speak of? We've got. [01:14:06] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, you said you had a couple things that you were concerned about. [01:14:10] Speaker A: I can't really think of any others, if I'm honest. You, as we speak right now, have the privilege of hosting royalty in your country. My king. [01:14:19] Speaker B: That's right. We do have. [01:14:22] Speaker A: Your king is country. [01:14:26] Speaker B: I love that, like, Donald Trump always gets on TV and he's like, oh, yeah, we're like best friends. We're the. We're the best friends. He and I. We've known each other forever. We hang out. We're like. But I'm like, sure. He's like, I wish you wouldn't say that. This is not great for me back home. [01:14:43] Speaker A: It's. It's a very interesting situation. And not really. It's outside of our purview. [01:14:47] Speaker B: Yes. [01:14:48] Speaker A: But the. The. The diplomatic inequity in how we view our relationship with America and how I'm certain America views its relationship with us. Right. Has never been more clearly defined. [01:15:03] Speaker B: What would you say? That's actually really interesting to me. It's like, what would you say? Like, how do you think people in the UK see the relationship between. Because, again, my picture of this is maybe love actually, you know, when Hugh Grant gets up there and kind of rips, I don't know, Billy Bob Thornton, a new, new one. But what do you think? [01:15:25] Speaker A: I don't know about people in the uk, but over the last kind of six to eight months, we have watched RPM squirm and sweat and debase himself in the flimsiest and most fucking transparent attempts to carry favor with your president. Right, right. Going through the theatrics of producing an envelope from his pocket with an invitation to a state visit, refusing to respond to really fucking withering fucking insults from your president about our military and about the way our country is run. [01:16:07] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:16:10] Speaker A: Just all in the craven attempt at avoiding tariffs and maintaining diplomatic, you know, equity in what is referred to over here as, quote, the special relationship, end quote. [01:16:25] Speaker B: Right, Right. Yeah. [01:16:26] Speaker A: Is that a term you've heard? [01:16:27] Speaker B: I've heard the phrase, yeah. I don't think we use it. Yeah, I've definitely heard it. [01:16:35] Speaker A: We use it all the time. Every single PM in my memory has America is a trusted ally and we must preserve the special relationship of intelligence sharing and military cooperation. And it is. It's. It's never been clearer how for us, currying the favor of America is a massive deal to the American administration. They don't give a fuck. [01:17:03] Speaker B: Right. They never kind of has the. It's the vibe of, you know, the. The Mad Men meme of I feel sorry for you. I don't think about you at all. [01:17:13] Speaker A: I don't think about you. That is exactly what it is. Right. It's become ever more embarrassing to me as a British, like. Like super, super on a cellular level. Embarrassing to watch both opposition parties, our ruling party, even all of the also rans, all bar the libs, in fact, Lib Dems and I think, sorry, the Greens, right, have called a spade a spade and gone, this guy's a prick. Why are we kowtowing to him, right? But the Tories, reform, the labor government, all just tying themselves in the most embarrassing sweaty fucking knots to avoid calling a spade a spade and for calling him out as the fucking colossal cunt that he is. [01:18:01] Speaker B: Right? [01:18:01] Speaker A: Really, really embarrassing to me on a global level. [01:18:05] Speaker B: Yeah, it's interesting. [01:18:06] Speaker A: I'll tell you something else. [01:18:06] Speaker B: Oh, go ahead. [01:18:07] Speaker A: Why? Because you fucking reminded me now. Just impersonal news, right? Impersonal news. You might. You'll know that we're in the process of. Of trying to sell our house and buy somewhere new. [01:18:19] Speaker B: Right? [01:18:19] Speaker A: Right. [01:18:20] Speaker B: Yep. [01:18:22] Speaker A: In the year since we've been in this process, and it has been a year by now, the amount we're able to borrow on a mortgage in the last year, despite our financial circumstances in this household, improving has plummeted, of course. [01:18:40] Speaker B: Yep. [01:18:43] Speaker A: A very, very real and tangible material impact on the way our fucking lives are gonna play out. [01:18:52] Speaker B: Right? [01:18:53] Speaker A: Right. And I didn't fucking close the straight to Hormuze, despite what you might think. It wasn't me. [01:19:01] Speaker B: It wasn't. You weren't consulted. [01:19:04] Speaker A: A lot of people like to lay that blame at my feet, and I'm here to tell you right now, I had all to do with closing the Strait of Hormuz. [01:19:10] Speaker B: I owe you an apology then. [01:19:13] Speaker A: A lot of people do. Take a number. I didn't fucking do it. I didn't invade Ukraine. [01:19:21] Speaker B: Right. [01:19:21] Speaker A: I didn't leave the European Union. [01:19:23] Speaker B: Right. [01:19:24] Speaker A: I didn't do any of these things. [01:19:26] Speaker B: No. [01:19:27] Speaker A: And yet the effect has fucking drastically changed the course of our plans for our life as a family. Ergo, the life of my kids. [01:19:39] Speaker B: Right. Your borrowing powers down. Your electricity bills are up. Your. You know, everything is by decisions made by people who have nothing to do with you and that you didn't vote into place to do it. [01:19:52] Speaker A: Never even registered a synapse firings worth of thought in the decisions that were made. [01:20:00] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. [01:20:02] Speaker A: And it makes me so angry and sad. [01:20:06] Speaker B: Yep. It's a. It's a sucky time right now, you know, and, and to, you know, with the things that we were discussing a couple weeks ago in terms of like, just everything else that's going on with climate and all these kinds of things and that kind of stuff being on top of it. It's just a constant, like, barrage of things that's, like, I had no say in this. Why is this happening? Why is this happening? This is unhinged and it's very frustrating. [01:20:38] Speaker A: I had to get that out. I had to get that out of my. [01:20:40] Speaker B: No, you're, you're right. And I think it's, you know, in terms of going back to that special relationship thing, it's, you know, it's interesting to see and this will happen to us before long too. But obviously the British Empire is not a thing anymore. Right? And, you know, when this was established, there was more of, like a parody in the back and forth of what we got from each other that doesn't exist now because, you know, the Brits don't own anything that we need. And thus there's no reason to, like, when it comes down to it, like, care that much what's going on over there as far as the government is concerned. And so it, it is. It's galling for, like, you know, your government to then, like, constantly be bowing and scraping to a country that, like, could not be fucked to care what's going on. [01:21:36] Speaker A: Listen, I know I. I'm often given to hyperbole, but. And I, and I'm. And I truly believe that, you know, my thoughts on ideas of nationalism, that it's anachronistic, that it's outdated, that it's embarrassing, and that we can only move forward by putting that shit behind us. [01:21:53] Speaker B: Right. [01:21:53] Speaker A: But as a British man, it was. It has been absolutely excruciating to watch our administration tie itself up in knots to try and stay on the good side of a mercurial, immature bag of like, him. [01:22:09] Speaker B: Yeah. And as someone who is subject to that mercurial, Mercurial bag of. It is also frustrating that to watch nobody stand up to him from this side, like, come on, just like, pool, pool all your shit and like, really just like, destroy us for a minute. We'll figure it out. But, like, just, just Say no. Just say no. [01:22:35] Speaker A: Yeah. I have to get out of my system. [01:22:37] Speaker B: Yeah, no, it's. It's important. That's what we're here for. For getting all that. That rage on paper and whatnot. But do we want to talk a little bit about what we've been watching to. As a palette cleanser from all that rage? [01:22:50] Speaker A: We can certainly do that. Why don't we start with a movie? Why don't we start. Why don't we start with a divisive movie? [01:22:57] Speaker B: A very divisive movie. Yeah. Yeah. [01:23:02] Speaker A: What if. What if I told you there was a movie out there, guys that you could watch and gals and everybody in between don't give a fuck. I fucking love you all. What if I told you you could watch a movie about two people recording a podcast? But. But, but, but. But it's a haunted podcast. What about that? If you've got a theremin tone, you can add over that. That would be a great place to [01:23:33] Speaker B: put it on the. On its face. I'm not against the proposition, you know, as podcasters, you know, which may be a little in common with the podcasters at the center of the film Undertone. [01:23:47] Speaker A: We are talking about the movie Undertone. And when I say it's been divisive, I've equally. I've seen, as many people say, that it chilled them to their very marrow. [01:23:57] Speaker B: Everybody says it got under my skin. [01:23:59] Speaker A: Yeah. And I've seen exactly the same number of people going, terrible. [01:24:05] Speaker B: Yeah. It's like a straight divide right down the middle. [01:24:09] Speaker A: I did. You were right. It's a movie about two podcasters, and I felt. Called the out in the first 10, 15 minutes of this film. Because they're essentially us. [01:24:20] Speaker B: Yeah. Pretty much switched. Yep. [01:24:25] Speaker A: So the. The only discomfort I felt from that [01:24:27] Speaker B: movie was, yo, is that me? [01:24:31] Speaker A: Wait a minute. Hey, what you fucking. You fucking watching me? You looking at my fucking life? So it's a movie about a haunted podcast, Right. A podcast which is recorded at a distance, much like Joe Ag. [01:24:45] Speaker B: Yep. [01:24:46] Speaker A: One of the hosts has a elderly dying relative just off in. In the. In the bedroom, just away from the room, which she records. And listen. Hey. One of the hosts gets sent a lot of audio files from a listener, and he thinks maybe they're haunted. Don't listen to the Haunted Files, you think as a viewer. But you know what he does? He does listen to the haunted files and listeners. They're haunted, Right? [01:25:16] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:25:16] Speaker A: And it. It makes this very clear that this is what the movie is about. Within about 15, 20 minutes, right? [01:25:22] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:25:24] Speaker A: And vividly. So vividly I might even have said it to you at the time, I thought to myself, well, it's gonna have to do better than this. [01:25:32] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. You were like, I am not watching this if this is what the movie is going to be. [01:25:38] Speaker A: Those were my exact words. I'm not watching two hours of this. And I thought to myself, wait a minute. This is an A24 joint, right? [01:25:47] Speaker B: Yes, it is. [01:25:48] Speaker A: They wouldn't just give you this at face value. A movie about fucking ten Spooky Wav files. Which is what? This is a movie. [01:25:58] Speaker B: I wish that was what it was [01:25:59] Speaker A: called, 10 Spooky Waves, the movie. It wouldn't. It wouldn't just be this. But it. That is what it is. [01:26:09] Speaker B: That is what it is. [01:26:11] Speaker A: In its defense, each successive wav file gets more spooky than the last. [01:26:16] Speaker B: Sure. [01:26:17] Speaker A: Doesn't it? By the 10th file. Whoa, there's fucking. She's writing. She's drawing shit in crayon. [01:26:28] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:26:28] Speaker A: You know what I mean? [01:26:29] Speaker B: What do you do when you're spooky? [01:26:31] Speaker A: When spooky things happen, you automatic writing in crayon and, oh, shit, I've made a spooky drawing and her nan is suddenly up and about and acting all spooky in the bedroom. And until the fucking closing credits, I kept telling myself, this isn't all it is. There's gonna be more. They're gonna pull. I was looking at the rug under my feet and just waiting for them to whip it out. [01:26:56] Speaker B: There's gonna be some big thing they do that isn't just a trope in every other horror movie. [01:27:01] Speaker A: You gotta give me more than this. It's 2026, man. [01:27:05] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. [01:27:06] Speaker A: You gotta give me something more than this. Than 10 spooky wa. Do not. [01:27:12] Speaker B: It is no. [01:27:13] Speaker A: Premise offered, premise delivered. [01:27:16] Speaker B: Yep. [01:27:17] Speaker A: That is undertone. However, I'm built different, Right. [01:27:24] Speaker B: As we know. Yes. [01:27:25] Speaker A: I, I. Everyone ask around, right? I'm fucking built different. And maybe this movie isn't for me. Maybe those of you who aren't as battle scarred as I am, as tough as me, might have got scared here. A lot of people have. I've seen people saying this is some of the scariest they've ever seen. [01:27:47] Speaker B: Right? Yeah. I don't. I don't see it. I think also, I mean, it's tough to get into something when the acting is bad and terrible. One of the things about this is like, you know, the two leads, obviously, they're on a podcast, and it's not like they're not you. And I Were looking at each other when we. We podcast. [01:28:09] Speaker A: Look at you right now. [01:28:10] Speaker B: So we. Why would you not see, right, like, It's. Again, it's 2026. Why would you just be, like, calling each other to make your podcast? But as such, you know, all we have is their voices for the acting of this. We have one person and then the voice of the other person. And that means they need that, like, chemistry to be really good. It really needs to, like, you know, we have to believe the conversation that they're having right here, because that's all we've got. And there it is. It does not exist at all. There's no chemistry between these two people. It does not sound like they are actively recording a podcast together. They could have recorded this at completely different times and it would have sounded no different, to be honest. [01:28:55] Speaker A: And they me, among other things, in this movie a couple of times whilst chatting off, you know, about the spooky goings on in the audio files, they were like, okay, let's record a bit of the podcast. Okay, let me just get into character. Do people do that? [01:29:12] Speaker B: I mean, we kind of do that, but we usually do it before. Well, not into character per se, but we do sometimes do a bit beforehand and then do it. Like, we warm up later. We warm up. Yeah. But, yeah, that's when she was like, yeah, let me. Let me get back into character. I was like, so are they. That confused me. I was like, so is this supposed to be a fictional podcast? Like, I was genuinely confused by that. [01:29:37] Speaker A: Surely the whole hook of. Of podcasts is that you. You're listening to unfiltered real. [01:29:45] Speaker B: Right. [01:29:45] Speaker A: People having real conversations. [01:29:47] Speaker B: Unless, you know, it's like a fictional podcast. [01:29:50] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:29:50] Speaker B: Genre of thing, too, which is fun. Like, okay, so is this a fictional podcast? But they got. But these 10 spooky wave files actually are haunted, and they weren't expecting them to be. Fine. But then you have to, like, tell me that, like, I don't understand now what the relationship is between them and these things they're listening to, because she has just said she has to get into character for this. [01:30:16] Speaker A: This was a dull, uncommon a 24L. [01:30:22] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:30:23] Speaker A: Very sad. Very saddening to me that this is a movie that existed and I had no idea. Right. The only. I only hear this movie when you hopped on at me to fucking watch it about nine times. [01:30:35] Speaker B: You're like, okay, we watch it. That's not entirely true. The first time that I. No, wait. And I can pull up the receipts if you want. But the first time That I said, can you see if you can get Undertone? Your response to me was, I've been quite eager to see that too, but it's not available. Do you want me to pull up the receipts? [01:30:57] Speaker A: Only because I've heard. Only because I had heard other people talking of it in, you know, in revered tones. I didn't know what it was, what [01:31:04] Speaker B: it was, but it wasn't just me. It wasn't. [01:31:07] Speaker A: It's on you, is what I'm saying. [01:31:10] Speaker B: No, this was. I mean, obviously we had to watch it. Like you said, it's divisive. Either people are like, oh, this really got on great skin. Or they're like, this was terrible. So what, we're gonna not watch it? Let's be real here. [01:31:25] Speaker A: What about the discourse? What about the culture? [01:31:26] Speaker B: We have to watch it for the culture. That's what we're doing here. So from our perspective, don't waste your time with Undertone. However, Canadian boy Ryan of that other horror podcast, he's a great bunch of [01:31:39] Speaker A: lads, don't get me wrong. [01:31:41] Speaker B: Yeah, he loved it. So, you know, bunch of lads. It's really kind of a. I don't know, maybe watch it with headphones because apparently the sound design is like a very key element to finding this extremely [01:31:57] Speaker A: spooky, is that the sound design is gonna rescue it. [01:32:01] Speaker B: The sound design is gonna rescue it, apparently. I don't know. That's what people say. I don't think that that movie could be rescued also. I mean, it's a demon movie, and I hate demon movies. It's like, it's very satanic panic. [01:32:16] Speaker A: I love a demon movie, but this [01:32:17] Speaker B: movie is, like deeply satanic panic. And, like, people have pointed out, they're like, it's got like a weird anti abortion message in it too. That, like, doesn't need to be in there. Yes, it does. [01:32:29] Speaker A: It also. It also incorporates boomer fear of YouTube and social media. [01:32:35] Speaker B: Right? Yeah. It's like super conservative in this. It's got backwards masking. Like, it's very much like, oh, my 1980s satanic panic shit. [01:32:47] Speaker A: Oh, my fucking God. In 2026, you come to me with hidden backwards satanic messages in WAV files. That's what you come to me with, is it? That's what you lay at my door. [01:32:58] Speaker B: The sauce week, friends. [01:33:00] Speaker A: On your fucking way. [01:33:04] Speaker B: So, yeah, no points for undertone from this crew. I went to the. The theater and watched the drama as well, because obviously Zendaya, our Pats. That's another. You gotta. And it's a. It's a good movie that is very. There's people who are like, it's exactly what the trailer says. I think the central conceit of the movie that you find out, like, you know, 15 minutes in really is important to what the movie is. [01:33:36] Speaker A: There's an outside chance that I might watch this, so. Spoiler. [01:33:39] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna spoil it in any way. This is why I said the central conceit and not what actually happens, which people have been calling a plot twist. It's not a plot twist. It is the thing the movie is about. Yes, but, yeah, it's a good movie. It's just. It's very much the thing that I hate in watching things, which is white people overreacting. So I did not enjoy. Yeah, like, that's. The whole movie is overreacting and hysterics from white. [01:34:12] Speaker A: I know you love that. [01:34:13] Speaker B: And so I was just miserable the entire time I was watching it. Like, everyone calm the down. [01:34:21] Speaker A: Yeah, let's. [01:34:23] Speaker B: Let's just talk this out, you know, and it's all gonna be okay. But it's, it's a good movie and Zendaya and Robert Pattinson are so great in it. But I did not enjoy it. Not one. I'll watch again. But, you know, it's good for conversation, too. Me and my friend Seth ended up having sort of a conversation about. We had, like, different perspectives on, you know, some of the way things unfolded and what the movie was trying to say about it, which was fun. So, yeah, the drama's worthwhile. [01:34:51] Speaker A: I've seen. I've seen pics of you with your friend Seth. He's got a lovely face. [01:34:55] Speaker B: He's like a very smiley. You know, we have a very similar energy, me and Seth. [01:35:01] Speaker A: Yes. Seth gives me really, really, really excellent energy. [01:35:04] Speaker B: Yeah, he's good people. [01:35:06] Speaker A: I will talk briefly of the first. Finally the first minute of footage from Evil Dead Burn. [01:35:16] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [01:35:16] Speaker A: Which has finally made it, which I [01:35:18] Speaker B: actually, I haven't actually watched the trailer because. [01:35:20] Speaker A: Oh, you should, you should, you should. [01:35:22] Speaker B: I should. I was just waiting to see if it would be before something that I went to see on the big screen instead. Before, like watching the trailer, I was like, oh, I'm sure something I'll see will have it. It hasn't. [01:35:33] Speaker A: It's. It's nuts. You all. I'm sure you all would have seen it, but what. What we got served up wasn't what any of us were expecting. What we got served up is a roughly one minute long unbroken shot. Think Children of men. Of someone crawling on their elbows across the floor of a grimy, dusty, gritty fucking house as mayhem unfolds around them. People are slammed into walls. People are torn from surfaces and flown into the air. Things fall off walls, there's fucking blood. Deadites and just there's the. The shot is full of beautiful subtleties. Deadites like we haven't seen before. Ravening Deadites like zombies, you know, gibbering and screaming and biting. And just in the last kind of few seconds of the trailer, if you, if you're not looking in the right place, you'll miss it. If you're focused where the trailer wants you to focus on the girl crawling across the floor to try and escape the carnage, you'll miss a Deadite fucking levitating across the frame in the background. And it was then I fucking knew it was right then I knew that this movie was plugged in to that fucking decades long chapter fucking canon of Evil Dead lore. We're gonna get something different this time. We're gonna get something new this time, but we're gonna get the flavor that we love. God, I'm so fucking pumped. I love loving stuff, right? I love, I love to love Evil Dead. You, you said that you'd seen it, called the. The most consistent franchise in all of horror. And I find it very difficult to refute that. [01:37:22] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, indeed, There's. There's very few that manage. I mean, it was, I think it was like a conversation between people that I sent that someone had said something like that and that it was like, yeah, basically every single entry into the franchise is good. You know, there's no stinkers. They said that it was like the only franchise with more than three movies with no skips. [01:37:48] Speaker A: Basically impossible to refute. It's five for five on great movies and a fantastic TV show. Point me towards even my most beloved Elm street as a fucking whiffer or two in there. You know what I mean? [01:38:02] Speaker B: Definitely. [01:38:03] Speaker A: I'm man enough to admit that. But Evil Dead just. It doesn't miss. It doesn't fucking miss. [01:38:09] Speaker B: I say, it's so funny. So you texted me and you were a bit miffed that I had given the 2014. Is it 2014? 2013? [01:38:19] Speaker A: 13. [01:38:19] Speaker B: 2013. Evil Dead 3.5 stars. [01:38:23] Speaker A: Disappointed is more the word. I wasn't angry. I was sad. Literally, I was sad. Oh, well, I actually out like, oh. [01:38:30] Speaker B: And then you posted your rankings of them and I did not realize that's your number one. [01:38:36] Speaker A: Yes, it is. Yes, it is. I have no clue And I've. I've come to that conclusion that unassailable. I know I'm right in this. Evil Dead 2013 is the best movie of the lot. But that only speaks to one of the things that I'm so passionately just awestruck about by the Evil Dead franchise is in you. You could pick up any one of those films and get a completely different style of movie, but with the same. The flavor that you keep that marks it out as being uniquely Evil Dead. [01:39:08] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. [01:39:10] Speaker A: And 2013 is. Fetty Alvarez's reinvention of Evil Dead in 2013 is. Fuck, man. You either get it or you fucking don't. And there are so many people who can't get past Ash on the Evil Dead Reddit. There's so many. Every fucking day someone will post a question, hey, guys, do you think Ash will ever come back? Hey, guys, I saw Bruce Campbell. [01:39:31] Speaker B: Certainly not now. [01:39:32] Speaker A: Fuck off. Well, probably not now, no. But talk about a movie which broke through completely what people thought it was and what thought it could be smashed through the limits that Sam Raimi had set for Evil Dead. And that sounds ridiculous because Evil Dead has no limits. Like I said, Evil Dead 2 is. [01:39:54] Speaker B: But I think this establishes that, right? Because, like, I mean, obviously it didn't have limits before, but, you know, there's like accepted parts of kind of that canon or whatever things that you. You're like, I know that this is going to be like Ash, like, this is going to be a part of this, right? And then. But without the 2013 Evil Dead, you don't get this. Like, Evil Dead Rise, you know, and what is now coming with these next two movies, like, because Reinvention gives permission to reinvent from that point forward, right? It's like, all right, there's. What rules that exist are basically, like, there are Deadites here. Like, that's pretty much it. Do whatever the fuck you want with it. From there. [01:40:34] Speaker A: Evil Dead 13 is flawless. It is without flaws. It has that quality of Evil Dead 2 where every single second is propulsive and moves it forward. There isn't a single wasted fucking moment. Nothing you could cut, nothing that you could skip. The. I personally am absolutely giddy over the conceit of putting a junkie, putting an addict in the final girl role. It's a great swerve. It's a great piece of misdirection. It gives real dramatic heft to people not believing the shit that she's coming out with. And once again, I am on this hill ready to take your arrows and Fucking die. It has comedic notes now. They aren't immediately apparent. [01:41:21] Speaker B: Right. [01:41:22] Speaker A: But after you've seen it and letterboxd tells me I have 11 times, it becomes apparent that there is comedy in Evil Dead 2013. Comedy of excess, of building and building until you. You. You think. Just when you think it's got as rough as it's gonna get. Oh, surprise, you know. Yeah. Don't talk to me about undertone being a movie with great sound design. Right. Evil Dead 2013 has great sound design choices, sonic choices, which on paper make absolutely no fucking sense. You know, when it's about to get bad because they. They fucking start up an air raid siren when the Deadites are about to fucking throw down. That's fucking mad. What? Fuck it. It all works. Evil Dead 2013 is absolutely flawless. And thank you for coming to my TED Talk. [01:42:15] Speaker B: Well, say the last time that I watched it was with you and Dan in that virtual thing in the. [01:42:22] Speaker A: And for that you give three and a half stars. What is that movie? [01:42:25] Speaker B: Here's the thing I described this. 3.5 stars is not bad. It's that 7. I really. [01:42:31] Speaker A: That's damning with faint praise. [01:42:33] Speaker B: This is not how you normally rate movies. The way that I look at it is 3.5 is. It's a movie I really like, but I don't crave watching it like you do. Like, I don't like sitting. And I'm like, oh, you know what I'm really in the mood for? That's. It's just not what comes to mind in that way. That's why it has a 3.5 and not, you know, a 5, because it's like. It's a movie I really like. And if it's on, like you put it on in the headset, I'm like, I'm in. I'll watch. It's not a movie I'll say no to. [01:43:03] Speaker A: It's just not one. [01:43:04] Speaker B: I would. [01:43:04] Speaker A: I think I can turn you around on it. [01:43:07] Speaker B: There's nothing to turn around. I think it's a really good movie. [01:43:09] Speaker A: Well, there is this. You've got a star and a half there of flexibility. Right. And I think based on what I've just said, I think you're gonna watch it again soon and I think it's gonna click for you. [01:43:20] Speaker B: I mean, again, it's. There's nothing to like. [01:43:22] Speaker A: It's gonna click. [01:43:23] Speaker B: Load simply that. Okay, we'll give it another. I mean, I've seen it probably four or five times at this point. Which tells you, like, it's A movie I enjoy. It's just, like, not one that I'm like, you know, on a day, on a rainy day, I'm like, you know what? I'm, like, craving right now. That's all. So it's not a, like, dig at the movie. It's just that it's like. It's not what I come back to over and over. Like, it's usually someone else is watching it. I'm like, yeah, I'm in. I'm all for it, but I'll watch it again and we'll. [01:43:53] Speaker A: It's a very special piece of work. [01:43:55] Speaker B: We'll see how it. How it goes. I'll just. I got to do like, an all of them through kind of thing before it comes time for the. [01:44:04] Speaker A: I feel as though that's something that we should get the discord involved in. [01:44:08] Speaker B: Oh, that's true. Yeah. [01:44:09] Speaker A: I. I'm. I've been. I haven't put a watch along in the calendar in ages. [01:44:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:44:14] Speaker A: February, March, really poor show. So I. I wonder who'd be interested in an Evil Dead watch along. Not the show, because that's a lot of work. [01:44:21] Speaker B: Yeah, it's too much, but yeah. Oh, yeah. I think we could definitely get the crew together for some Evil Dead to Evil Dead. I'm on board for that. So let us know if that sounds like a thing you. You would enjoy or not. We'll just do it and you can show up or not, you know? [01:44:37] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. [01:44:38] Speaker B: We're not here to tell you what to do. [01:44:41] Speaker A: No. So. To the pit. [01:44:43] Speaker B: Well, you also watched Dread. I don't know if you wanted to [01:44:45] Speaker A: talk about that at all, but I'll talk on Dread. Briefly. Watched it with the kids. Right. Watched it with the boys. [01:44:54] Speaker B: 15 years old. Interesting. So you're, like, really starting to, like, push things a little more now. Like, ever since the, like, RoboCop wasn't gory enough, you're like, you know what? All right, let's do this. [01:45:05] Speaker A: Let's find. Let's find what? What's gonna make you go? Let's. Let's. I'm looking for certain noises. I'm looking for jumps. I'm looking for kind of facial expressions. And I'll find them. I'll fucking find them. I'm your father. [01:45:16] Speaker B: But now, you know, nobody's taking it to bed with them. I feel like that's the important, important part of it is, like, in the moment, they can be as scared as they, like, as long as they're not, like, crying at midnight. [01:45:28] Speaker A: And Owen and I had A conversation first. So hang on. They're cops, but they can arrest people and kill them and execute them without trial, like. Yeah. And what does that make them, Owen? Fascists. That's correct. The judges are not the good guys here. They may do action hero, fucking cool movie shit. But watch the movie. Watch it with, you know, take a little step back and look at what's going on here. The judges are not the good guys. You get that, don't you? Oh, yeah, for sure. You got that. Yeah. And dread. Fascinating. Fascinating movie, that. With retrospect, I always remember it looking like a fan film. And it does look like a fan. [01:46:08] Speaker B: It has that kind of softness to it. For sure. Yeah. [01:46:12] Speaker A: They've done a lot with little. I feel. [01:46:15] Speaker B: Exactly. [01:46:16] Speaker A: Dread. It's a object lesson in putting it all up on the screen and doing the very best you can with a scrappy budget. [01:46:24] Speaker B: Yes. 100%. Yeah. Full passion project. [01:46:27] Speaker A: And a hell of a good time. Just a hell of a good time. A four and a half star good time. It. It gets in all the points you want it to get in. He says, I am the law. He doesn't take the fucking helmet off. [01:46:39] Speaker B: Nope. [01:46:39] Speaker A: Not even once. [01:46:41] Speaker B: No. He was very, very set on that when he was making the movie. [01:46:45] Speaker A: It's not coming off. Lots of, Lots of nods. If you're a 2000 AD guy who knows the law. Lot more than I'd realized. I, I caught a lot more on this viewing that is rewarding for people with, With a, With a knowledge of 2000 AD. [01:47:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:47:02] Speaker A: Which I'm not. I'm not a massive. Those in AD guy. I read it a lot as a kid. I've read some anthologies, but I, I, you know, it, it. It's made by people who know their. [01:47:11] Speaker B: Yes. You know, very much so. [01:47:15] Speaker A: And is super violent. The CG hasn't held up well, but the movie has. And I think I would enjoy it more than robocop. [01:47:27] Speaker B: Okay. [01:47:28] Speaker A: Which is interesting considering that how much they have in common. [01:47:31] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. Like, that's really interesting. Very nice. But yes. Last week while we were talking, you had finished season one of the Pit and I had not started it. And now we have both finished both [01:47:47] Speaker A: seasons of the Pit. [01:47:50] Speaker B: I caught up. Yes. It's got this. I mean, you, you disagreed because you need to focus a little more. But it is like just the right rhythm that I can be fully engaged in what's going on and also grade stuff, which is really rare. And I think it's in large part due to the lack of music now. [01:48:09] Speaker A: Music is super distracting, what you've just described there. I. It made me worry that you. That you'd miss for a. For an HBO Max show, for a primetime show, for a show that needs to do well and to get big numbers, for a show that needs to be renewed. There is such a lot of blink, and you miss it. Character detail. [01:48:34] Speaker B: Sure. Yeah. [01:48:35] Speaker A: In the show. I'll give an example. Right. Forget. I can't remember what his ailment was because the patients in the pit come and go at a dizzying rate. [01:48:44] Speaker B: They do. Yeah. It's like, sometimes it's, like, really easy to keep track of, but especially in the second season, not so much. [01:48:50] Speaker A: The patients come and go at a dizzying rate. There was a guy in one of the bays called Mr. Green. Right. And he wore, very subtly, a green pair of trousers and a checked green shirt. Mm. Right. And I was never once referenced. They didn't even mention, hey, Mr. Green. All wearing green. And when one of the doctors is reading his notes, you learn that he's a teacher. [01:49:16] Speaker B: Mm. [01:49:18] Speaker A: So you've obviously got here Mr. Green, who's doing a little green thing with his fucking clothes for his class. [01:49:24] Speaker B: Right? Yeah. [01:49:25] Speaker A: And it's never even fucking mentioned. You as a viewer are left to fill that in. [01:49:30] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. [01:49:30] Speaker A: And that is so rewarding. [01:49:32] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. [01:49:34] Speaker A: So rewarding to have a character that has lived a life before he got to your screen. [01:49:40] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:49:41] Speaker A: Which, you know, he did, like, live after he got you to the screen, but sure. What that is, Stanislavski calls it the through line. You know what I mean? You can just draw a line for that guy's life. He's a. He's obviously a fun teacher in class. He, you know, he encourages Mr. Green. The Green teacher wears green clothes. Yeah, I know. And that was all sketched out without any exposition at all. Show don't tell. [01:50:11] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. I mean, it doesn't have time to tell you anything, you know, so you have to pick up all the little bits and pieces of things and. Yeah, you're right. There's always these just little, you know, quips or cues or things like that that. Yeah. You. You put things together. It's not. There are things that obviously it does kind of tell you explicitly, but, you know, there's a lot that's going on that's simply just. [01:50:35] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:50:35] Speaker B: Happening. [01:50:36] Speaker A: And characters who you spend two seasons with, which, of course, is only two shifts when you learn, you're always learning more about them just in single shots or in single glances or single lines. It is a skillfully Woven show it is. And the more I think of it, the more I realize that you can love it on either level. You can. You can watch it like ER if you want. You can watch a fast paced hospital drama and enjoy the dislocations and the gore and the feats of fucking surgical daring do. But what it also does, Corrigan, which I love, is it fucking swings at the issues. [01:51:13] Speaker B: Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. [01:51:14] Speaker A: This is a fearless fucking show that comes out swinging at every fucking issue you could possibly care to mention. [01:51:23] Speaker B: Which I think is really bold considering hbo, you know, and all the merger bullshit and things like that and everything is at risk on there considering the very conservative bent that the owners want to take and whatnot. So it's when they take those big swings at things like ice and whatnot and having trans characters and, you know, [01:51:46] Speaker A: all this stuff, it is anti AI. It is anti cop, it is anti American health care. It is. It is. It is anti everything that I think you are, you know. [01:51:56] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. [01:51:57] Speaker A: By you, I mean you the listener, [01:51:58] Speaker B: not you the listener. Well, yeah, me too. [01:52:03] Speaker A: Fearless, fearless, fearless show. [01:52:05] Speaker B: Very bold show. And, you know, and I think I really appreciate things like I was telling you, just not only is it the lack of music, but the lack of makeup or the makeup that is done like real people do it. [01:52:21] Speaker A: Great point. [01:52:21] Speaker B: You know, is such, like an important element of this show because having just like super pretty people automatically puts you on a. This does not. [01:52:33] Speaker A: Yeah, A layer of distraction, a layer of attachment. [01:52:35] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And so, you know, what was that? [01:52:39] Speaker A: No, go on, please. [01:52:40] Speaker B: Yeah, it just. To me, you know, like, we're both talking about, like, not recognizing Fiona Doriff at first in this show. Right. Like, because she doesn't look like two [01:52:48] Speaker A: before I realized that was Fiona Durif. Yeah. Didn't take that long, but spotted Brad Durif in season one. I just completely failed to register. Chucky. [01:53:00] Speaker B: I texted you and I was like, oh, my God. And her dad plays her dad. You were like, I did not notice that. [01:53:07] Speaker A: So dialed in. Was I? [01:53:08] Speaker B: Yeah, I know, right? You're, like, so concerned that I'm not, like, paying enough attention. You were like, I missed two dwarves in this. So I don't know. But, you know, I think just little details like that to me, like, make it so that you really feel like you're in their world, you know, And. And the way that they interact with people. Like, at times I would catch myself thinking, like, how do they even script this? Because there's things they do that are so human. Like. Yeah, say Someone's leaving their shift is over and they're finally leaving the hospital and they'll have like a little back and forth talking to each other about, you know, what they're going to do for the weekend or things like that. And they. The person goes to leave and the personal say, you know, you know, drive safe. And they'll, you know, respond. Like one woman respond to that. Like, you know, and it's like, that's. Yeah, that's how you would respond, but like, that's not a thing you would put in a script. Right. You know, how do you get people to respond so. So naturalistically, just like they would in the real world. I think it just, it really helps you to just be in it that everybody acts and looks like people. [01:54:16] Speaker A: Obviously the gore is first rate. [01:54:18] Speaker B: Yeah, I, I did. Yeah. When we talked about it last week, I was like, oh, I don't know, I'm bad with gore. And I'm like, no, I can handle it. But it is like Owen was when. [01:54:29] Speaker A: When Owen was in the room for the episode with the guy with the perma boner. Nice. Which we got a good old chuckle out of. But you see a full fucking. Not just like a brief half a second shot. You see a full shot of a vaginal birth. [01:54:46] Speaker B: Of a birth delivery. Yeah, didn't love that. That took me back to childhood when I, you know, my family is very crunchy. You know, me and my sister were born at home. And so, of course, you know, the midwife came and showed me the miracle of birth video and I saw that stuff, we had all the books and stuff, and I was like, I am never fucking doing that. That's not happening. No way. And watching that, I was like, yep, that's. That's what. At age 3, I was like, that's not gonna happen. [01:55:14] Speaker A: But it's against, you know, TikTok Wellness. [01:55:18] Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, yeah. It has several things of, like, moms who nearly die because they, you know, decide that they're gonna follow Tick tock. [01:55:27] Speaker A: And then every so often, these characters with skins as thick as pachyderms, when you see the armor break and when you see how close every single one of those people sails to the edge, and it hits like a ton of bricks. I've honestly just episode after episode after episode of season one, much like the bear I watched through misty eyes, it was it. It hit home so hard, that show. [01:55:54] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. And. And the second season, especially towards the end of it, really gets more so. Yeah, really in there. So if you're, if you're not watching it yet. The Pit is one you gotta get in on. I had the other day in my Welsh class the. You know, every week she asked like, what do we do this weekend? Or whatever. And I said, you know, I'd been watching the Pit and just blank stares from everyone in the class. I was like, none of you are watching the Pit. [01:56:20] Speaker A: I've been recommending it. [01:56:22] Speaker B: What's going on? [01:56:24] Speaker A: I've been recommending it to every colleague I've spoken to. [01:56:26] Speaker B: I feel like everybody's watching. Like, I was like, oh. I'm like really late to the party on this. So I was like, how? I mean, everybody in my Welsh class, aside from like three people, are 60 plus. So that's probably part of it as well. [01:56:39] Speaker A: My only. It's not even a criticism. But it's got Dan Brown syndrome in that the cliffhangers are very cheap. [01:56:47] Speaker B: Yeah. And. But it gets you. You're like, God damn. What? I'm gonna just leave this here? [01:56:52] Speaker A: Exactly. [01:56:53] Speaker B: You've got a nurse being strangled and I'm not gonna watch the next episode [01:56:57] Speaker A: off, like, welcome back. The 24 format. [01:57:00] Speaker B: Yes. [01:57:01] Speaker A: Welcome back. We missed you. What if. Er. But the bear. But 24. That's what this show is. It's all of the best bits of those shows in one show. [01:57:09] Speaker B: And now, unfortunately, we're both caught up. So. [01:57:12] Speaker A: Yeah. What next? [01:57:13] Speaker B: What now? What? Tune in to find out what our next TV club is. Yes. [01:57:18] Speaker A: Yeah. And tune in on the Discord because we are doing the road to Evil Dead boon. [01:57:23] Speaker B: Yes. Let's do this. Also, I'm gonna put on there the I pitch it to you many months ago, but hadn't gotten around to putting it on the Discord, a hotel that I found a premiere in which we know is a thing that I really like, that I learned from Mark's brother. And one that is really good. It looks like for if people stay there for our meetup, we can all hang out, which is coming and whatnot. [01:57:47] Speaker A: Which is coming. [01:57:49] Speaker B: We're at less than four months now. [01:57:52] Speaker A: Yep. We know how these times pass. It's coming crazy. We're gonna see some of you soon in a Conway. It's gonna be amazing. [01:57:58] Speaker B: I'm gonna. I'm gonna see you soon, Mark. Cause I'm. [01:58:00] Speaker A: Yeah, you come. [01:58:01] Speaker B: I'm take that. [01:58:02] Speaker A: Bring my Texas Chainsaw Blu Ray. [01:58:05] Speaker B: I know. I've got a little bag of Mark things bring along and snacks apparently. Or is that for August? Maybe that's for August when you know the. I don't know if the kids are coming along to the meetup. But anyways, I will post that in the Discord so that if you want to start getting hotel rooms and whatnot, we can. We can do that and just be that much closer to hanging out. [01:58:28] Speaker A: You guys, I think it's going to be the best night of all of our lives. [01:58:33] Speaker B: I think it's bound to be. [01:58:34] Speaker A: Yep. [01:58:35] Speaker B: Today, this could be the greatest day of our lives. [01:58:41] Speaker A: You couldn't help it. [01:58:42] Speaker B: I couldn't help it. [01:58:44] Speaker A: I mean, I felt this episode was going quite well up to a point. [01:58:47] Speaker B: Well, it's always a little better with a little take that. [01:58:51] Speaker A: Stay spooky.