Ep. 257: a real bastard

[00:00:04] Speaker A: Okay, so set the scene in advance here. Set up what you're going to be hearing from me right now. [00:00:11] Speaker B: All right, let's do it. [00:00:13] Speaker A: You always got to set the scene. You always got to let people know what they're in for, right? [00:00:17] Speaker B: Yeah, it's important. You got to get that establishing shot right out. [00:00:20] Speaker A: Exactly. That's what this is. So two topics gonna jump between the two topics from one straight into the other. There is connective tissue. There is a through line here, right? All right, you're gonna learn something. You're gonna learn something. You're gonna learn something about a real motherfucker, right? [00:00:37] Speaker B: Oh, okay. [00:00:38] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. I'm gonna talk to you this evening, Corrigan, and indeed, listeners gonna talk to you about a real bastard, all right? A real. A real son of a bitch. [00:00:50] Speaker B: You know, we don't have enough of those at this point, so it's good to. You know, I'm gonna talk to you [00:00:55] Speaker A: about an historical motherfucker here. Right? [00:00:58] Speaker B: Let's do it. [00:00:59] Speaker A: And I'm gonna preface this by asking you, have you ever heard of something known as the McDonald Triad? [00:01:10] Speaker B: McDonald Triad. [00:01:11] Speaker A: The McDonald Triad. Is that a term you've ever heard before? [00:01:15] Speaker B: No, I don't think so. [00:01:18] Speaker A: Okay. [00:01:18] Speaker B: Not to my knowledge. Hit me with it and we'll see if anything. It's. [00:01:21] Speaker A: It's. It's probably for the best that you haven't. And if you haven't by now, you probably won't, because the McDonald triad is a. A model almost of psychiatry, of forensic kind of psychology that is widely discredited now since it was first posited in the 60s. Right, right, right. Fella by the name of J.M. mcDonald who first came up with the McDonald triad. It's sometimes called the homicide triad or the sociopathy triad. [00:01:59] Speaker B: Oh, do they call also like the dark triad? Right. [00:02:02] Speaker A: That's another term I have heard. Yes, that's another term. [00:02:04] Speaker B: Okay, I do know what you're talking about. Yes, I am familiar with this. [00:02:08] Speaker A: What this kind of details is behaviors in childhood or adolescence which, according to MacDonald, provide a really reliable indicator of a child's later propensity to become a killer. Right? [00:02:28] Speaker B: It's like things like. Like killing animals. [00:02:31] Speaker A: That's one part of the triad. Correct. [00:02:33] Speaker B: Isn't like wetting the bed or something like that? [00:02:35] Speaker A: Enuresis is another part of the triad. You do know the triad? [00:02:41] Speaker B: I do know what this is. It's wetting the bed, hurting animals. [00:02:45] Speaker A: Yeah, Come on, Come on. [00:02:46] Speaker B: I don't remember what the third one is. I. I'm Gonna have to. Two out of three. [00:02:51] Speaker A: Okay. Well, you've done. You've done brilliantly. [00:02:53] Speaker B: Oh, thank you. [00:02:54] Speaker A: You're quite right. Cruelty to animals is the first. The torture, the murder of animals for control or for pleasure, that is one side of the triad. Enuresis, chronic age inappropriate bedwetting is another. [00:03:11] Speaker B: Right. [00:03:11] Speaker A: That isn't, you know, doesn't have any medical kind of cause, but is continues past a kind of a. Yeah. [00:03:20] Speaker B: When most of us stop doing that. [00:03:22] Speaker A: Exactly. Five, six years old. The other part is fire setting. [00:03:28] Speaker B: Ah, fire setting. [00:03:30] Speaker A: Burning shit for the Now. If, according to McDonald, a child displays those three parts of the triad, it's a pretty safe bet that they are going to turn into, you know, a problem. [00:03:49] Speaker B: Right. [00:03:50] Speaker A: It was a part of the early work of the behavioral science unit of the FBI. [00:04:00] Speaker B: Okay. Yeah. [00:04:01] Speaker A: They based a lot of their behavioral science studies on it after interviewing lots of incarcerated serial killers. So if you think of btk, Son of Sam, they all, they, they, you know, those and, and, and others fit in that profile. Exhibited parts of the triad. [00:04:22] Speaker B: So this is the kind of stuff that the mindhunter guys would have been the mind pops. [00:04:26] Speaker A: Yes, exactly. However, it does not represent what we might call good science. [00:04:35] Speaker B: Sure. I mean, even like just thinking about that out the gate, like the herding animals part. Yeah, absolutely. You never meet someone who hurts animals in childhood and you're like, yeah, but the other two seem tenuous and at best, and I understand the idea is it's like, oh, all three together. [00:04:55] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:04:55] Speaker B: But the idea of late bedwetting and setting fires, which is a thing like most kids enjoy doing. [00:05:04] Speaker A: Yeah, I certainly did. [00:05:06] Speaker B: Convincing. Yeah. Oh, me and my neighbor Jenna set fire to so many things. [00:05:10] Speaker A: Oh man, the shit we would burn when I would go camping with my mates. In fact, in the weeks leading up to a camping trip, my friends and I would hoard deodorant cans and make explosions in the forest, in the woods. [00:05:29] Speaker B: We would see, at least, you know, you went out. That's always a good thing. Like, me and Jenna once almost burned her room down because we wanted to see how flammable banaka was. Do you have banaka? [00:05:40] Speaker A: What is Banaka? Banaka? What is that? [00:05:42] Speaker B: Yeah, it was like a spray, breath spray that was popular in the 90s. [00:05:49] Speaker A: Okay. Yep, yep, yep, yep. [00:05:50] Speaker B: And like we. You guys have pinaka? [00:05:54] Speaker A: I needed to get. [00:05:55] Speaker B: That's what it's called, Mark. [00:05:57] Speaker A: I needed to get that out my fucking system. Because you're still very hoarse, aren't you? [00:06:01] Speaker B: I am very hoarse right now. Yeah. I sound A little more like, we'd use banana banaka. You guys hate me. Anyways, we sprayed banaka on an index card. And the index card, it turns out it's very flammable. [00:06:14] Speaker A: Oh, cool. [00:06:15] Speaker B: And then kind of Jenna just sort of threw it gambit on impulse. Yeah. And we ended up, both of us having to, like, take pillows and stuff like that and put it out as it, like, slowly start. Well, quickly started to spread around the room. [00:06:30] Speaker A: Interestingly, now I think of it, I also displayed the opposite of fire setting. I used to freeze stuff. Did I ever tell you about that? [00:06:38] Speaker B: Freeze things. [00:06:39] Speaker A: Honestly, this sounds like I'm making it up, right? But I fucking. I am telling you. And. Okay, if Alan's listening, he'll. I'm hoping maybe he'll be able to confirm this. I was talking about this very fucking behavior to my kids at dinner recently. I had a big phase where I would freeze my action figures in water. [00:06:59] Speaker B: Huh. [00:07:00] Speaker A: So I'd have action figures, Star wars figures and whatnot. I would get an empty pop bottle and fill it with water and I'd pop the action figure in the bottle and freeze it. [00:07:11] Speaker B: You guys, this man didn't know he was autistic till 47 years old. [00:07:20] Speaker A: I would love it. [00:07:21] Speaker B: Amazing. [00:07:22] Speaker A: One droid. I can't remember the name of the droid, but there was a particular droid. And I can see this. [00:07:26] Speaker B: It's, like, really satisfying to freeze. [00:07:29] Speaker A: Oh, he was great. I would put him in a bottle and freeze him up. Melt them down. [00:07:33] Speaker B: And then what would you do? [00:07:33] Speaker A: Just melt it. Do it again. [00:07:35] Speaker B: That's it. Just that. On a loop. Okay, [00:07:41] Speaker A: do it again. [00:07:43] Speaker B: Sure, why not? [00:07:46] Speaker A: That's so good. [00:07:47] Speaker B: So anyway, it's good. All right. Yeah, go on. [00:07:49] Speaker A: McDonald Triad. You know, you don't have to think too long and hard about it to work out why it's bollocks. Lots of kids who do that stuff don't turn into fucking serial killers, right? [00:08:00] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:08:00] Speaker A: And there's lots of serial killers who never did that stuff. [00:08:02] Speaker B: Stuff, Right. Yeah. [00:08:04] Speaker A: It doesn't hold up. In fact, not only is. Is, you know, not only are those behaviors in the McDonald triad not a reliable indicator of murder in a kid's future. It's more a. They're seen more as distress signals, you know, indicating. [00:08:22] Speaker B: Well, I was gonna say. Yeah, it's like anxiety, right? [00:08:24] Speaker A: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. So it's horseshit. [00:08:28] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:08:29] Speaker A: That said, that said, I'm gonna talk about a guy. I'm gonna talk about a. Who Displayed in his past, in his childhood. Strong, strong, strong indicators of McDonald Triad behaviors. Right. [00:08:46] Speaker B: All right. [00:08:46] Speaker A: And this guy turned into a son of a. I'm gonna talk to you about Marcel Petio. [00:08:52] Speaker B: Marcel Peter. [00:08:54] Speaker A: Does the name ring a bell? [00:08:57] Speaker B: No, I don't think so. That one's not on my radar. [00:09:00] Speaker A: All right. Okay. So as you may have gathered, we're in France here. [00:09:05] Speaker B: Yes. [00:09:06] Speaker A: Right. [00:09:07] Speaker B: You put on an accent. I got it. It was either, I guess, like Canada. [00:09:10] Speaker A: Petio, what if I told you that at various points after his life and death, he was known as the Butcher of Paris? [00:09:24] Speaker B: Oh, okay. [00:09:25] Speaker A: What if I told you he had, in some quarters, in the press, been known as Dr. Satan? Dr. Dr. Satan. God damn right. Born in Auxerre. A U X E, double R, E. Auxerre in France towards the end of the 1800s. 1897. [00:09:48] Speaker B: Okay. [00:09:49] Speaker A: And [00:09:51] Speaker B: we get some good killers around then. [00:09:53] Speaker A: Well, this I'm. I'm astounded. Not only that I. That neither of us adhere to this guy. [00:09:58] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:00] Speaker A: As a child, known to be articulate, known to be intelligent. [00:10:07] Speaker B: Nothing spookier than a kid that's too smart. [00:10:10] Speaker A: Oh, mate, that should be part of the. It should be. The McDonald's square [00:10:18] Speaker B: kid, too smart kid. [00:10:19] Speaker A: Too smart. Talks like grown up, manipulative. You know, his teachers and later doctors, psychiatrists, also categorize him as impulsive, dishonest, aggressive. He was blighted by the death of his mother. His mother died when he was around 12. And by that time, by adolescence, PTO was already quite well known to police, to school authorities. [00:10:57] Speaker B: By 12. [00:10:58] Speaker A: By 12. By 12. Truancy, theft, intimidation. Just bastardry, right? [00:11:06] Speaker B: Intimidation. Yeah. [00:11:08] Speaker A: See, there's well documented claims of him smothering a pet cat to death as a very young child. He was a pisser. He would piss the bed. Right. [00:11:27] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:11:27] Speaker A: Chronic misconduct. Truancy. So what I'm Saying is strong McDonald triad behavior, right? [00:11:35] Speaker B: Yeah. He's. He's checking all the boxes. [00:11:37] Speaker A: Antisocial conduct, more importantly, without meaningful consequences. [00:11:41] Speaker B: Oh, he missed fires. Was he. Was he lighting fires? [00:11:44] Speaker A: There is. There is repeated records of male tampering of setting a post box on fire. [00:11:53] Speaker B: Okay, right. Yep. [00:11:55] Speaker A: But the point here is no consequence. He was expelled from schools. He was moved around schools, but his behavior was allowed to continue elsewhere. In a highly notorious incident, he took his father's revolver into school. [00:12:18] Speaker B: Oh. [00:12:19] Speaker A: And fired it in class. No one was hurt, no one was killed, but he shot a gun off in one of his classes. Arrested for crimes, like I said. Robbing post boxes. The theft. At 17, he was assessed as unfit to stand any kind of Meaningful criminal trial through being mentally unstable. [00:12:41] Speaker B: That's bonkers. To be able to be, like, extremely smart. [00:12:45] Speaker A: Yes. [00:12:45] Speaker B: And then they're like. But also manipulative. You're not responsible for yourself. [00:12:49] Speaker A: Yeah. How mentally unstable was he? [00:12:53] Speaker B: Right. [00:12:53] Speaker A: Or was he playing manipulation? But keep this in mind. Right. Because in 1916, so we're in the First World War here. Petio volunteered for the infantry, for the French infantry. And was wounded, gassed on the front lines. And. And came. Was sent home with what we would now know as ptsd. [00:13:23] Speaker B: Sure. [00:13:25] Speaker A: But while hospitalized. Right. Whilst in hospital for these injuries, he would steal morphine. He would steal personal property from other patients. Well, he would steal army. Army supplies, blankets. He would just thieve from other patients while in hospital, was arrested. Again, not criminally responsible. The military courts ruled him as being unfit to stand trial due to mental disorder. [00:14:00] Speaker B: It's so like. Oh, go ahead. Sorry. [00:14:03] Speaker A: Yeah. Despite doctors, some doctors recommending he be institutionalized long term, he was still, once again discharged. [00:14:13] Speaker B: I'm fascinated by this kind of thing, you know, especially. I'm not a psychologist or anything like that, so I don't have a lot of insider knowledge on how this works. But, yes, the idea of the way people's minds work like this, like, on the one hand, like, you can't really argue they're not in some way mentally ill because if they weren't, they wouldn't do that. Right. And having. I'm trying. I try to imagine what it would feel like to always have a compulsion to do bad or. Right. Because that is a thing that I can't conceptualize. I don't have compulsions to, like, you know, maybe something silly or, like, you know, you might think, like, oh, what if I shoplifted this or whatever, and it doesn't really have, like, huge consequences. Right. You're not taking something meaningful from someone or whatever. Like, I can understand a little bit of, like, intrusive thought. [00:15:06] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:15:07] Speaker B: But the idea that, like, always your impulse is to harm. [00:15:14] Speaker A: Exactly. But, you know, you. You make the point there, and it's something that I've wondered a lot while in the joag era of my life. Is itinerant bastardry a mental illness? [00:15:31] Speaker B: Well. [00:15:32] Speaker A: Or are some people that Bookers? [00:15:35] Speaker B: Yeah. Well, I mean, there was that book, and I can't remember what the author is, and I posted her TED Talk in our Facebook group a while back, but that looks at sociopathy as, like, a form of neurodivergence, actually. And through her book, she actually makes a lot of, like, comparisons that do make sense to the kind of compulsions that you do have as a neurodivergent person. And a lot of hyper fixations and things like that. And she kind of talks about, you know, the intrusive thoughts and what they cause her to do. [00:16:06] Speaker A: Speaking of intrusive thoughts, super quickly, right, I got the news on in front of me, and they're showing a screenshot from Twitter, right, of your President Trump boarding Air Force One. And on the right hand side of the page, they've got the current Twitter trending topics. Number one, hashtag Danhausen. [00:16:25] Speaker B: He's the number one trending topic above, above everything else. [00:16:30] Speaker A: Anyway, I apologize. Yeah, go on. [00:16:31] Speaker B: You were saying Trick was more successful than we thought. But anyway. But yeah, like her kind of thing is like, if you think about this sort of in a similar way as you would think about autism and adhd, but the fixation is instead on harm, then like in that sense you can kind of understand it. It's just that I can't conceptualize that being my impulse, you know, and it has to, obviously, like, you know, you don't really hear of like people coming from like super great families and like no trauma or whatever and having. And then becoming a serial killer, like that's not a thing. So it feels like it's like, you know, some level of neurodivergence mixed with trauma that manifests as I must harm people all the time. I don't know. Yeah. A thing I just can't relate to. And that makes it so fascinating. [00:17:23] Speaker A: Well, what if I told you that Petio is just getting started? [00:17:27] Speaker B: Oh boy. All right. [00:17:29] Speaker A: Because in 1916. Oh, I apologize. No, no, no, [00:17:37] Speaker B: skipped ahead. [00:17:38] Speaker A: I did, I did skip ahead because. After coming out of hospital, what Petio did was enroll in a kind of a post war plan in France to address doctor shortages after the war. And got himself on an accelerated education program and underwent a super compressed medical education. [00:18:14] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:18:15] Speaker A: And in 1921, got himself qualified as a doctor. [00:18:20] Speaker B: Great, right? That's just what you want. [00:18:23] Speaker A: This fucking guy, repeatedly judged unstable, fucking psychologically unable to stand trial for his bastardry, is now licensed after a super brief kind of crash course in medicine to practice as a doctor. Which he did. [00:18:47] Speaker B: Awesome. [00:18:48] Speaker A: In 1922, he established a practice in Vienneuve sur Lyon, in France, of course. And this is where things fucking go absolutely bonkers. Right? His practice quickly became known for narcotics distribution. [00:19:12] Speaker B: Yeah, nice. [00:19:13] Speaker A: Illegal abortions, issuing kind of false medical certification, financially exploiting his patients. [00:19:25] Speaker B: It's like he found like a, a path to A respectable career. [00:19:30] Speaker A: Yep. [00:19:30] Speaker B: It was like, all right, how can we make this deeply seedy? [00:19:34] Speaker A: Yeah, you don't even know if. If you can get your head around this. In 1926, he entered local fucking politics and was elected mayor of Vienneuve sur Aon. [00:19:49] Speaker B: What? [00:19:50] Speaker A: In the 1920s. [00:19:52] Speaker B: In 1926, he's a very good sociopath. [00:19:55] Speaker A: A very brief tenure marked by fraud, embezzlement. He was caught stealing electricity from the town fucking power supply. [00:20:05] Speaker B: Stop. Good Lord. [00:20:09] Speaker A: Yeah. Convicted in 1930 and removed from office. [00:20:13] Speaker B: Now that's some Jersey politics right there. [00:20:16] Speaker A: For sure. For sure. In 1933, completely disgraced, yet a free man. He relocated to Paris. And then, of course, the German occupation of France begins. [00:20:35] Speaker B: Okay, [00:20:37] Speaker A: this gave Petiot an incredible environment, Right. To change his fucking name, which he did. Dr. Eugene. Eugene relocated, set up a false identity, [00:20:54] Speaker B: and once again, is that his first name or his last name that he. His last name was Eugene. [00:20:59] Speaker A: No, his. His real name. Well, Dr. Eugene, I guess would be his surname. That was his alias that he used. [00:21:05] Speaker B: Oh, okay. [00:21:08] Speaker A: And once again, started up his business of forging documents, finding the most desperate of people. [00:21:14] Speaker B: Right. Which, of course, there are going to be many more. [00:21:17] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:21:18] Speaker B: At this point. [00:21:19] Speaker A: Yeah. What if I told you that he constructed a fraudulent escape operation from Nazi occupied Paris? [00:21:31] Speaker B: That's like. What. What's that. What's that podcast that I just had you listen to with the gal who like, made up the fraudulent escape thing from like Afghanistan or whatever? [00:21:43] Speaker A: Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. [00:21:46] Speaker B: Unicorn girl. [00:21:47] Speaker A: Yeah, Unicorn Girl. Yeah, Very similar. But. But Corey. But Corey, he claimed whilst in Paris, that he could smuggle people out of France through Portugal to South America. [00:21:59] Speaker B: Right, okay. [00:22:01] Speaker A: Targeted Jews. Targeted Jews who were going to be deported. Charged. Targeted resistance members. Charged them a fucking ridiculous fee of some 25,000 francs. [00:22:14] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:16] Speaker A: Told his victims to bring everything they owned to bring their valuables to pay for their new life. But Corey. Corey, he told his victims that to get them into South America, they need vaccinations. [00:22:39] Speaker B: Oh. [00:22:40] Speaker A: And he injected them with cyanide. [00:22:43] Speaker B: Oh, my God. Holy. You were not kidding. That is. [00:22:49] Speaker A: Talk about like a. Using the environment you are in as a cover for the darkest fucking crimes. [00:22:59] Speaker B: That's so evil. Holy shit. [00:23:03] Speaker A: Stripped. I'm like, fucking. Victims of all valuables and clothing. Stowed their cases. The first bodies he would dump in the Seine. [00:23:14] Speaker B: Wow. [00:23:14] Speaker A: He started dissolving people in fucking quicklime pits. Moved on to incinerating remains in a fucking furnace. [00:23:25] Speaker B: Of course. Yeah, why not just go with the theme? [00:23:30] Speaker A: Until his work continued until 1944. He was doing this for fucking years. [00:23:40] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:23:41] Speaker A: Until neighbors, neighboring tenants complained of the smell. Complained of the smoke. [00:23:50] Speaker B: Wow. [00:23:50] Speaker A: And while he was. [00:23:51] Speaker B: He was doing this, like, in his [00:23:52] Speaker A: house, in his practice, I guess in his. [00:23:55] Speaker B: Okay. Wow. [00:23:56] Speaker A: Right. [00:23:58] Speaker B: It's not that smart, as it turns out. [00:24:01] Speaker A: Well, rather ambitious, I think, more than anything else. When things. Firefighters broke into his premises. They found dismembered bodies. Corey. They found heads with faces removed. They found. [00:24:18] Speaker B: Oh, my God. [00:24:19] Speaker A: I'm serious. They found hands with the fucking fingertips filed down two huge ovens with bone fragments in them. 72 fucking suitcases full of clothes and personal effects. Incredible. Shit. [00:24:38] Speaker B: I'm like, speechless. [00:24:40] Speaker A: Wild. Yeah. [00:24:41] Speaker B: I like. Like you said before, I can't believe neither of us had heard of this guy before. [00:24:47] Speaker A: Can't believe it. [00:24:49] Speaker B: And it's like, this is. It's like taking all of the different kinds of, like, horrific people and like, blending them into one guy. Like, it's so this. So many forms of depravity meeting here. [00:25:06] Speaker A: And he goes on the run. Right? [00:25:09] Speaker B: Okay. [00:25:09] Speaker A: He adopts another fake name, Captain Henri Valery. Grows a beard. [00:25:16] Speaker B: I like that. He couldn't just, like, be a random guy. He's like, oh, I'm running, but I'm gonna be a captain. [00:25:20] Speaker A: The hubris. [00:25:21] Speaker B: Like, seriously, the hubris. Come on, dude. [00:25:26] Speaker A: And, you know, whilst on the run, he joined the French military again. He joined the French forces of the interior in espionage. Right. Whilst hiding from justice himself. But he was recognized in October 1944 on the Metro in Paris. [00:25:47] Speaker B: Wow. [00:25:48] Speaker A: While he was caught, he was carrying some 32,000 francs in cash. [00:25:55] Speaker B: That sounds like a lot. [00:25:56] Speaker A: Yep. I guess. Dozens of false identity papers. [00:26:03] Speaker B: Wow. [00:26:04] Speaker A: And was. [00:26:05] Speaker B: I guess you could be like, I'm an espionage, maybe. [00:26:08] Speaker A: But it didn't do the trick. He was finally brought to justice, finally caught and stood trial in 1946. All the while during his trial, insisting he was a patriot, insisting that he was targeting the enemies of France. [00:26:24] Speaker B: Yeah. This is where, like, it really. You know, that's where you start to really see the, like, sociopathy and like, the personality disorder stuff is. It's like, it's not just that he did this. It's that, like, he also thinks he's, like, the smartest guy in the room. You know, he's never had a consequence for any of this. And he's like, it's because I'm so good at it and not because the system sucks. Right. [00:26:49] Speaker A: And was eventually convicted of 26 counts of murder. [00:26:55] Speaker B: And it had to be more. Right? You said Cases in his house. [00:26:59] Speaker A: He claimed he'd killed 63, but he was convicted of 26. His stories of helping the resistance. His stories of only killing enemies of the state was completely dismantled. And he met Madame Guillotine on the 25th of May, 1946 with some banger. Last words as well. [00:27:25] Speaker B: Oh, hit me. [00:27:27] Speaker A: Gentlemen, I have one last piece of advice. Look away. This won't be pretty. [00:27:34] Speaker B: What an asshole. [00:27:35] Speaker A: What a dick. [00:27:38] Speaker B: Oh, man, it's almost annoying that he thought he was, like, being cool as he went, you know? [00:27:44] Speaker A: Yep, yep, yep, yep. [00:27:45] Speaker B: Really, I'm gonna hit him with this wisdom. [00:27:48] Speaker A: Eyewitnesses, you know what I mean? He, he, he is said to have been unrepentant, calm. [00:27:54] Speaker B: He's basically doing like the, the wint deal there, right? I'm, I'm not mad. Don't put in the paper. I got mad. [00:28:00] Speaker A: Yes. [00:28:01] Speaker B: Like, oh, close your eyes, guys, you know, no big deal. They're just gonna behead me. You might want to look away, like. [00:28:07] Speaker A: But what a case, what a case, [00:28:09] Speaker B: what a case, what a case. I was. You said in the beginning that it was going to be, you know, next level, but, oh, yeah, I was not prepared. [00:28:19] Speaker A: And, you know, it, it. This one hits that really nice sweet spot whereby it's recent enough history for it to be validated. There's. There's nothing apocryphal about this. Very. [00:28:34] Speaker B: Well, weird details. Yeah. [00:28:35] Speaker A: No, no, no. This is in the press. This is in the fucking. In the records, you know. [00:28:40] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. This is the 20th century. We were alive in that century. [00:28:44] Speaker A: Incredible. Medicine, politics, just. Yeah, mad shit. Marcel Petio, you absolute rest in piss. Let me quote directly from my notes, if I may. [00:28:58] Speaker B: Yes, please do. [00:29:00] Speaker A: Look at these nerds. Oh, I don't think anyone has ever [00:29:04] Speaker B: said measles said in such a horny way before. [00:29:07] Speaker A: The way I whispered the word sex. [00:29:08] Speaker B: Cannibal received worst comes to worst. Mark, I'm willing to guillotine you for science. [00:29:13] Speaker A: Thank you. That's really, really sweet. It's cold outside, but my pancreas is talking to me. I'm fucking. I'm gonna leg it. [00:29:19] Speaker B: You know how I feel about that, Mark? [00:29:22] Speaker A: I think you feel great about it. Hey, just jump in. We took a week off last week because Corrigan's been ill. [00:29:31] Speaker B: I'm dying over here, man. It is still. It is rough. I mean, listen, I got a cold. Everybody has a cold. It's so funny. I've been, you know, I use the Bereal app. Do you know what the Bereal app is? [00:29:44] Speaker A: Never heard of it before in my life. But I'm good. I'm gonna stop you there. You can go back to the Bereal app, but tell you something. An app, if you want to talk about apps, an app that Owen and I have been using a lot this past couple weeks. Sorry, I'll let you finish. Right. Do you have. Do you have Too Good to Go over there? [00:30:03] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, I love Too Good to Go. [00:30:05] Speaker A: We are fucking caning. Too Good to Go of late. [00:30:07] Speaker B: Yeah, it's the best. Especially when you're traveling. Like if you're in a hotel somewhere, usually they'll after like the like breakfast period or whatever is up. Yeah, they will put breakfast on there. Five bucks for like what you would normally pay $20 to go and get. [00:30:26] Speaker A: Yesterday I paid Starbucks four quid, right. For like 30 quids worth of pastries in fucking credible. Me and Owen ate like kings. [00:30:34] Speaker B: This is. I do this like every, like once a month. I go and I get for 5.99, my favorite bagel place does like a dozen and a half bagels. And so we get them and then we freeze them and we just like eat them for weeks. [00:30:50] Speaker A: See, you like to freeze things too. [00:30:53] Speaker B: Well, look at that. Just like you. [00:30:55] Speaker A: When it comes down to it, we're just the same. [00:30:57] Speaker B: I freeze them and then I unfreeze them. But you're good to go. If you. For those of you who don't know, is an app where places at the end of the day to reduce food waste. You can buy their leftovers essentially for cheap. So it's usually around here it's bagels and pizza largely. But there's some other places that right [00:31:17] Speaker A: here is pastries, delicious, sweet baked goods. [00:31:19] Speaker B: Yeah, lots of pastries, things like that. But there will be places that have like full meals and things. Like there's a diner downtown that has like a vegan meal that they have every single day, that they have the soup of the day and stuff like that. Like, so great. So if you don't have the Too good to Go app, you're missing out. Especially if you travel. Very good way to get cheap food when you travel. [00:31:41] Speaker A: Very nice. Back to your illness. [00:31:43] Speaker B: Bereal. The Bereal app is an app that once a day it will say, hey, time to take a picture. [00:31:53] Speaker A: Oh, right, yeah. [00:31:55] Speaker B: To do it right. Technically you can do it late. It'll just say you were late. But you're supposed to take a picture of whatever you're doing at that particular moment. It gives a front camera and a back camera at the same time. And this whole week, everybody on there has just all been, like, lying in bed with a cold. [00:32:13] Speaker A: Is it widespread? Is what you've got all over? [00:32:15] Speaker B: Yeah. Well. And as I was telling you, America. Yeah. You were saying I'm one of those people who takes being sick, like, as a personal fan. [00:32:22] Speaker A: Well, yeah, I was gonna say that just before we started. I liken Corrie in many ways, actually, but most presciently, I liken Corey a lot to Vincent Kennedy McMahon, who is famous for seeing any signs of personal weakness, any signs of illness or physical fallibility as failure. You know, what you've done, Corey, is you've let the virus win. [00:32:43] Speaker B: I let it win is what happened. And, you know, anyone who knows me knows that I'm, like, pretty careful about not getting sick. [00:32:49] Speaker A: I hate being sick. [00:32:49] Speaker B: I would say I don't want to. Fastidious, yes, fastidious. Right. I get my shots on time. I wear my mask. I do all these kinds of things. But we went to go see a play in New York, and I reached into my pocket and I did not have my mask. [00:33:04] Speaker A: Ruh Roh. [00:33:06] Speaker B: The whole crowd was just, like, sniffling, coughing. The lady behind me. The whole time, you could hear, like, you know when someone's just flipping, flowing from their nose, like, just constant. The whole time, I was like, I'm gonna get sick. This is. I'm taking this one home with me. And sure enough, three days later, down for the count. [00:33:26] Speaker A: And it really describe it for me at its worst. How was your nadir of this? [00:33:30] Speaker B: Well, the thing was, it was, like, in waves. So it was like, I woke up last Thursday and I had, like, a scratchy throat. And I was gonna see our dear friend Colin that night. And I was like. I'm like, this might just be, like, allergies or something, but I'm not going to risk it. I don't want to get them sick when they're on vacation in New York. So I was like, nope, not going to hang out. And so then it was like, yeah, it's a little scratchy. And then, like, the sore throat got worse until it was like, really? Just like, this is. This is terrible. I want to die. Sore throat. Like, I can't swallow kind of sore throat. And then that, like, waned, and. And then it moved to my nose. So it was like two separate things. So then I started to get sinus shit after that. [00:34:15] Speaker A: Do you have any kind of illness behaviors? Do you have, like. Do you have any, like, degenerate behaviors that you indulge in when you're super ill. [00:34:25] Speaker B: I mean, I'm just, like, a mess. More than anything. Like, the house was a disaster. Cause I didn't clean up after anything. And my dog loves tissues. Like paper towels, tissues, toilet paper, anything like that. And so he was. If I put down, like, a. Like, blew my nose and put it down, he would steal it and then tear it up and leave it all over the house. So it was just, like, a disaster everywhere. And so when Kia was coming home and I was, like, finally kind of on the up and up, I was like, I need to clean the house. And it was just walking all over the house, picking up disgusting old, like, tissues and whatnot. But mostly I just, like, eat soup and watch tv. Like, I'm not. Like, I feel like you must have a habit because you asked that question. What is your sick degeneracy? [00:35:11] Speaker A: All I just eat. I eat and I fucking eat and I eat and I eat. Had you asked me a couple of years ago, I would take opioid painkillers. Just. [00:35:21] Speaker B: Sure, yeah. [00:35:23] Speaker A: The hardest fucking downers you could find, I would take. I would take Valium, just knock myself the fuck out. Dihydrocodine. Just knock myself the fuck out. Xanax, maybe. Just coast through it. Just coast through it. [00:35:38] Speaker B: See? And you know, my sort of, like, attitude towards, like, drugs of any kind is usually either they don't work. Like, any kind of, like, you know, like, opioids don't really work with Ehlers Danlos syndrome, or I don't like the effects because I don't have control of it. And so, like, I'm pretty. I don't take a ton of medicine, but I, like. You know, I went to the pharmacy and, like, picked out, like, you know, like, ask them questions about, like, which one's gonna make me stop coughing, which one's gonna. Blah, blah, blah. And then I just downed nyquil every night to, like, sleep. Because the worst part. [00:36:15] Speaker A: Delicious. [00:36:16] Speaker B: I. You know, I hate this, like, not having control. That's the worst part of being sick. And it was like, I'd go to bed and it was like I'd start focusing. Focusing on, like, I can't breathe. Right. And then I would be, like, freaking out that I couldn't breathe and, like, pacing, like, walking around, like, what do I do? Like, it was awful. So, yeah, I just started taking NyQuil in large quantities. [00:36:41] Speaker A: Just making some, like. [00:36:42] Speaker B: Exactly. Yes. It's my scissor. Yep. So now I'm not sick anymore. But if you're an early Joag listener, you also know I Have terrible lungs. And so it's like the bronchial stuff is still there. So when I breathe it sounds like there's like popcorn in my esophagus. And the other night I legit scared my dog because my, like, my esophagus was whistling when I breathed. And he, like, woke up and started barking and then he kind of, like, realized it was coming from me and he came over and like, sniffed me, like, well, fuck is that? [00:37:22] Speaker A: Yeah, all of which is. But we are back. Corrigan is deaf. [00:37:27] Speaker B: So that's why. Listen, it was a. It was a heck of a month, you know, it was like. First I chopped the ends of my fingers, you know, and then we tried to record a. Let's play my mic. Didn't work. Then I got sick and it was just like. It was a month of failure. [00:37:44] Speaker A: Yep, sure. But anyway, all of which is to say we're back. We didn't get the chance to have a quick debrief on our Prison Abolition. [00:37:53] Speaker B: Yes. [00:37:53] Speaker A: Episode. I have to say that I found Cheryl to be. I found her to be authoritative. I found her to be charismatic. [00:38:06] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, absolutely. [00:38:08] Speaker A: Super charismatic. I found her to be engaging. [00:38:12] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:38:14] Speaker A: So, so, so I could have fucking listened to her all goddamn night long. [00:38:19] Speaker B: Yeah, agreed. [00:38:20] Speaker A: So incredible to listen. [00:38:21] Speaker B: Incredible. Yeah. It's just, yeah, the way she speaks with such authority, but in such an engaging way. Passionate with everything. Passionate, you know, it makes you, like, makes you want to fix things. When you listen to someone talk about things like that. [00:38:36] Speaker A: It does. Does it get me any closer to what I sought from that episode? I don't think it did, however. [00:38:48] Speaker B: Right, okay. [00:38:49] Speaker A: Tell me why I. I can't put it any better than I think I did at the time when I talked about prison abolition as a thought experiment as opposed to a position. [00:39:02] Speaker B: Uh huh. [00:39:03] Speaker A: Wouldn't it be great if we had a society that didn't need prison? Of course it would. [00:39:10] Speaker B: Right. [00:39:10] Speaker A: Does that mean we can move towards prison abolition? No, I don't believe it can. Because in much the same. Do you remember when I asked Jeremy vine why we can't just shoot all our fucking rubbish into space? Right, right. And the response I got was, no, no, no, we have to fix things on our planet first and make a lovely planet to live in. Well, yeah, of course we do, but nobody's gonna fucking do it. And that's not happening, is it? In the same way. [00:39:36] Speaker B: So the issue here is more your pessimism about structural change, because her argument wasn't. Wouldn't it be nice if her argument Was you make structural changes such as decriminalizing things that are not criminal. You know that you add support systems. You know that, like, these are actual policy changes. They're not. What if the world were better? They're here. The structural, actual steps you would take to do that. So your issue is that you don't believe in people, basically. You don't think it'll happen. As opposed to that, like the. [00:40:12] Speaker A: That's. That's a kind of a oversimplification of my stance. I do believe in people. I believe in individuals. Yes. But I think, like I've said before, with the climate, I think we are now, at this point, a tipping point has been reached where we are inextricable from the structures which have fucked us. I think it's trying to get the cake out the egg. The egg out the cake. You know what I'm saying? [00:40:36] Speaker B: Yeah, that makes more sense. [00:40:38] Speaker A: I just said it backwards. [00:40:39] Speaker B: You said it backwards. And that was deeply confusing. Yeah. And I mean, this is kind of. I think at the end of the day, this is always our sort of back and forth between us is that I think it is more likely that people will make structural changes than you do. But I think. Yeah, ultimately then your issue with it is not about the policies or anything like that so much as that you don't think it can happen. [00:41:10] Speaker A: Yes, of course. [00:41:12] Speaker B: Which I think. Yeah. Is because what you started at was I don't see an alternative which is different. [00:41:19] Speaker A: But. But what. What became clear to me during that conversation was that the alternative is no alternative. The alternative is a society which doesn't need prisons. [00:41:32] Speaker B: Right. Which is not, I don't think, a piece of ever gonna happen. If you think about, like, you know, one of the things that I brought up during that is like, say, you know, mom, Donnie in New York. Right. [00:41:43] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:41:44] Speaker B: What they are working on doing is decriminalizing things, sending mental health professionals instead of cops to mental health issues. You know, not putting people in jail for things that they shouldn't be in jail for. You know, the idea that the biggest and most important city in the entire United States could do that and serve as a model is important. You know, and I think that's the problem with. I think the way that you're thinking about it means, to all the points that we talked about the other day is that we accept a society that is built on slavery. That's ultimately what it comes down to. And is that something that we're willing to just go, fuck it? Society is built on slavery. We can't do anything different than this. Because that's what you're saying, right. Is like, it would be nice, but society is built on slavery. [00:42:39] Speaker A: I, the only term I have trouble with is accepting it. I don't accept it. But I don't also think it at all likely that past this point in our air quotes development, it can be changed. [00:42:54] Speaker B: Right. So yeah, I think that's kind of the fundamental thing which is different from where your position was initially. I think even if you still think that it is unlikely to happen. [00:43:06] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:43:07] Speaker B: What you were coming from before was kind of a, like, there is, what would you do? Would you just, would you just let crime, you know, which is a very difficult thing. [00:43:17] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:43:17] Speaker B: But I mean, you know, [00:43:20] Speaker A: I, I, I still hold that, that end goal of abolishing prison, of abolishing incarceration, I still hold that that is almost a intellectual tool to get people to consider what society should be like to get us there. And as opposed to an end in itself. I think the societal change is the end. [00:43:42] Speaker B: Not, not for an abolitionist. But yeah, I think that as a, like, you know, as a goal for the rest of people, like if you, if you are wedded, we need prisons. Okay, then this is just an experiment in, you know, what are, how can we think outside the box. [00:43:59] Speaker A: Right. [00:44:00] Speaker B: People who are prison abolitionists, like I would consider myself think we do not need them. And that is the end goal is fucking gone. Right. But as you know, an idea of like, well, let's say that and then go for what, Which I think is kind of where she went in the end was like, all right, let's say you can't sign on all the way for that. Right. But can you sign on for these structural changes? Sign on that way. Right. Like, and to think outside of the constrictions of what we have thought about, you know, because I think for a lot of us, like, that's where it comes from first is to go, well, what would you do? You know, and it's like, well, let's think about this. Like, what if immigration wasn't a crime? You know, what if, you know, these X, Y and Z things, being poor wasn't a crime. What if you had these kinds of things in place that takes that entire element out? Well, there you already free millions of people. [00:45:03] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:45:03] Speaker B: From this system. Right. And so thinking outside of just the box of like, we need a prison and this idea of like, I think that was so smart was, you know, the idea that the worst of the worst are in prison, which is the exact same Thing that we use, the justification for ice and things like that. Well, it's. They got to go after the worst. The worst, right. And that she was like, that's a fiction. The worst of the worst are not in jail. That's not a thing. That's not where we're keeping them. [00:45:30] Speaker A: You know, I learned a f Ck ton. I learned an absolute shitload. [00:45:34] Speaker B: Yeah. I think it's just like the perspective that she brings to your point. Like, even if you're like, I just don't think that's ever the world that we're going to inhabit. Fine. But use that as. That would be my goal. And then how do you make the policies that would lead towards that? [00:45:51] Speaker A: Yes, I completely, completely agree. That's where I am. [00:45:55] Speaker B: Yeah. So very interesting stuff. If you missed that, you gotta go back and listen to it because, yeah, [00:46:00] Speaker A: you should do yourself a favor. It's quite, quite a personality, like I don't believe I've encountered before. Very, very engaging. [00:46:09] Speaker B: Yeah. There's two weeks of just incredible bangers with Eileen coming and talking to us the week before that, who everybody obviously adores. And like, oh, man, our discord was just lighting up with people being so excited about the things she brought up, including the demon core and whatnot. Everybody was stoked. [00:46:28] Speaker A: Look, it's been six years of bangers, right? Let's be fucking real, right? It's been six years of bangers. And we do it for you, right? The Jack of all graves audience, the jack of all graves faithful, the devotees, the fucking acolytes, the dedicated, those of you on the fucking journey with us, those of those of you doing the right thing and listening every fucking week, choosing to come into our world and to allow us into yours, right? And let me tell you something, we are one step closer this week to the real fucking world experience of Joag Live UK Edition 2020 motherfucking six. Right? [00:47:10] Speaker B: It's happening. [00:47:11] Speaker A: We're zeroing in on a venue. We have exchanged emails with a venue in London which is very promising. Very promising venue. Actually. [00:47:21] Speaker B: I'm really excited about this, actually. [00:47:22] Speaker A: A little bit fancier than I might have expected us to be able to get. [00:47:25] Speaker B: Maybe a little bit fancier. You know, it's got a little bit of class to it. Yeah, I mean, I would say that. [00:47:31] Speaker A: I know I am a classy guy. [00:47:34] Speaker B: You are. You're a classy guy. [00:47:35] Speaker A: I know you're a classy guy. [00:47:36] Speaker B: You're pretty middle class. Right. [00:47:39] Speaker A: I would push back on that. Maybe that's another conversation, another time. I'm working class as fuck and I always will be. But, but, but. Darling listeners, whether you're. Wherever you are, right you are. The door is open, the carpet is rolled out. You are invited. August 8th, 8th to the 8th, 2026. [00:47:59] Speaker B: Yes. [00:47:59] Speaker A: Which I now realize is my anniversary. But that's fine. [00:48:04] Speaker B: No, you didn't just now realize that I said that to you, Lauren. [00:48:07] Speaker A: I talked about. [00:48:09] Speaker B: I said, is it gonna be an issue that that's your wedding anniversary? And you said no. [00:48:14] Speaker A: We've been married a long time. [00:48:16] Speaker B: It's not a big one. [00:48:18] Speaker A: Things just stop naturing after a while. Things stop being important in a long marriage like mine. Things. [00:48:26] Speaker B: I would not let Kyo get away with that. But you know, things that to other [00:48:29] Speaker A: people might seem strange to us are commonplace. Things that seem important to other people to us. Tis nothing but the passage of time. [00:48:38] Speaker B: I'm actually fibbing anyway considering like most of the time Kyo is working on my birthday and on his birthday and sometimes on our anniversary. So really I'm being silly. But. [00:48:48] Speaker A: And he does. [00:48:48] Speaker B: Good. [00:48:49] Speaker A: I was more concerned than you were. [00:48:51] Speaker B: Does important work? Yeah. [00:48:53] Speaker A: Right. Let's not fucking forget. Let's not lose sight of the important things. But anyway. [00:48:59] Speaker B: Indeed. Hey. [00:49:00] Speaker A: Eight of the eight. [00:49:01] Speaker B: Get. Get yourself ready. We are. It's not, you know, it's not a pipe dream. [00:49:06] Speaker A: No, no, no, no, no, no. It's not a thought experiment. This is a goal with actual realistic, pragmatic steps towards it happening. And it's. [00:49:14] Speaker B: Mark is making a packet. [00:49:16] Speaker A: There's a packet. There's going to be a surrounding program of activities, right? [00:49:20] Speaker B: Yes. And excited about that. [00:49:22] Speaker A: Everyone. Everyone who's going to be there is going to have one thing in common and that's we're all on the joag journey together. Right. [00:49:28] Speaker B: True story. [00:49:29] Speaker A: Oh, it's gonna be sweet. [00:49:31] Speaker B: So good this is happening. As obviously I am still hacking. I've been trying to hit mute as much as possible. I apologize for the times that I have not managed to get to the button in time. I don't know, maybe I'll use the zoom recording and it'll take some of the coughing out, but we figured we'd take it a little easy today. [00:49:53] Speaker A: Oh, look, we haven't spoken about a [00:49:55] Speaker B: single movie since the start of February 26th. Insane was the date that I found on there. [00:50:02] Speaker A: We've got a fuck ton of movies to cover. I want to super briefly talk about the last book I read. Right. [00:50:08] Speaker B: Okay. [00:50:09] Speaker A: Ah man. Voracious. Everyday. Gotta read something. Gotta read a little bit of a book. Always got a book open right now. Book era. Right. Love it. Last book I read was called Nothing to Fear. Very interesting. Written by a. Nonfiction. Nonfiction written by a hospice nurse. [00:50:30] Speaker B: Okay. [00:50:31] Speaker A: And the subtitle of the book, I'm paraphrasing, but it's something like demystifying death to live a better life. [00:50:37] Speaker B: Mmm. I'm on board. [00:50:39] Speaker A: And it's from the. It's a hospice nurse who's quite big on TikTok, apparently. [00:50:45] Speaker B: Okay. [00:50:45] Speaker A: And it's talking about her experience in the realm of death, how to speak about death, how to normalize death, how to talk about death with the dying. Maybe she addresses. Maybe you're reading this book and you are dying. [00:51:04] Speaker B: Sure. [00:51:04] Speaker A: Here are the things I've observed as a hospice nurse. And here is what, in my experience leads to a better death. It doesn't mean how. Doesn't matter how long you've got to live, whether it's six months, six days, if you are intentional about planning and taking control of the death you want, then you can live out the rest of your days, however many they may be, in a better quality. And it was fucking fascinating stuff. [00:51:30] Speaker B: Okay, what was it called again? [00:51:33] Speaker A: Nothing to Fear. [00:51:34] Speaker B: Nothing to Fear. All right. [00:51:35] Speaker A: I have to check of the physical process of dying, what it might look like, what you might expect to see and hear and smell. She talks about what she's experienced with near death experiences. She does drift a little bit into. I mean, she's clearly religious, you know what I mean? But she's brief on that. You can disregard all of the nonsense, but the practicalities of that book are very, very impactful. Really quick read a couple of nights, sat in bed. Really fucking good. Really, really, really, really beautiful stuff. [00:52:09] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely have to check that out. [00:52:10] Speaker A: Yes. So movies, though. [00:52:12] Speaker B: Movies. Yeah, we've been moving. It's. I didn't feel like I've been watching a ton of movies, but then you [00:52:20] Speaker A: look at letterboxd and you have. [00:52:21] Speaker B: But then I look at the letterboxd and I have. [00:52:22] Speaker A: Have you seen any reviews for Scream 7? [00:52:25] Speaker B: Yes. [00:52:26] Speaker A: Oh, boy. Apparently it fucking stinks, which is good. [00:52:29] Speaker B: Yes. Also, someone spoiled it in response to, like, before it even came out. There's like, bloody disgusting. Has been doing a lot of articles about it or whatever, and someone was like, fuck this movie. You know, Free Palestine. You know, justice from Melissa Barrera. Also it ends, these are the killers and blah, blah, blah. And I was like, oh, okay, well. And I was like that. Listen, I'm a little annoyed, but also that helps me, amongst other things, to not have foam. [00:52:58] Speaker A: Knowing I'm not gonna see it. I've just read everything I can spoiler wise about it and it sounds absolutely dreadful. [00:53:04] Speaker B: Yeah, indeed. It's my favorite review that I saw of it was someone just said, we are watching Scream turn into Stab in real time. [00:53:12] Speaker A: Oh, nice. Nice, nice, nice. [00:53:15] Speaker B: Sounds about right. [00:53:16] Speaker A: Yeah, but we can go back. We've got a lot of movies to talk about here. We won't talk about all of them [00:53:20] Speaker B: in detail because we'd be here for fucking days a month of movies. [00:53:25] Speaker A: Yeah, I'll just rattle through if I made Dracula right? Not, not, not. [00:53:33] Speaker B: Did you not talk about that one? [00:53:34] Speaker A: I don't think I did. Right. [00:53:35] Speaker B: Oh, okay. You talked about it with me. Maybe. [00:53:38] Speaker A: I think the last movie we talked about was Feast. That piece of shit from the early 90s. Dracula. I'll say nothing about it. Right. Other than what a fucking. Ah, you got me. You pull the sneaky on me because I had no idea this film existed. And I sat through it all and I fucking enjoyed the shit out of it. A four star, full throated, action packed, fucking gory balletic violence, battle scenes, wonderful costumes, great performances, lovely cast. Just a really fucking amped up, modern day yet faithful Dracula story. Right? So good. So fucking good. Get to the end credits. Directed by Luc Besson. [00:54:27] Speaker B: Shoot. [00:54:29] Speaker A: Son of a bitch. You got me rough. I would never watch that movie had I known, but I did and it was great and I'm gutted. [00:54:36] Speaker B: Well, there you go. Yep. I know. [00:54:38] Speaker A: What a shame. [00:54:39] Speaker B: Kia watched it too. And I was like, do I explain? I'm just gonna let him have this. Not gonna. Not. [00:54:45] Speaker A: Did he enjoy it? Did he enjoy it? Did he enjoy it? [00:54:47] Speaker B: I think he thought it was fine. I don't think he was like, oh, it was great. But he was like, yeah, it was pretty good. [00:54:52] Speaker A: I really enjoyed it. [00:54:55] Speaker B: But yeah, so there's that. What else? What else do you. [00:54:59] Speaker A: I will also speak on Sisu. Road to revenge. [00:55:03] Speaker B: Right. [00:55:04] Speaker A: Magnificent. [00:55:06] Speaker B: Is it better than the first one? [00:55:07] Speaker A: It's as good. I love the first one. I actually, you know what? I think I seem to recall I enjoying. I enjoyed it more than the first one. I. I loved it. I loved it. Comic book, broad strokes. [00:55:19] Speaker B: Just. [00:55:21] Speaker A: I seem to be talking about Robert Rodriguez a lot on Joag lately, but interesting. It's very much in that kind of El Mariachi, amped right the fuck up, 10x kind of super fucking comic book action hero. Violent, but weirdly relatable. Man, everybody's just trying to go home, you know, Everybody's Just trying to get the fuck back home to something that they connect with. Everybody's just. Everybody just wants to get where they're fucking going, man. And everybody's fighting Nazis, aren't they? You know what I mean? [00:55:59] Speaker B: Yep. [00:55:59] Speaker A: We've all got our own Nazis to deal with. And Sisu asks the fucking question, what if you could pierce their fucking heads with anything that comes to hand and be invulnerable to violence. What if you could throw a pipe through someone's face? Or if you could stab someone in the throat? Or if you could throw someone 50 miles away, what if you could set your fucking car on fire and use rocket propelled gas tanks to break through a border whilst carrying your own childhood home broken down into planks, which you intend to rebuild in your native country? Everybody's got that to deal with, don't we? [00:56:36] Speaker B: Nice. [00:56:37] Speaker A: And Sisu, Roger Revenge paints that picture so vividly. Right. I want. I. I want you to watch this fucking film because it's great and it will make you cry. Because it made me cry. Right. [00:56:49] Speaker B: Wasn't expecting that. [00:56:52] Speaker A: I'm. I'm an easy mark for movies to make cry. I mean, I'm very well, that's true. [00:56:56] Speaker B: Yeah. In a film you are. You're a spigot. [00:56:59] Speaker A: Yeah, I am. I am. Of natural fluids gushing out of me. But Sisu will do that. Sisu Road to Revenge will do that. I. I'm a sucker for a struggle. I'm a sucker for an underdog. I. A sucker for somebody just getting what their heart desires. What a great movie. Let's have a third one and a fourth one. Fucking brilliant. [00:57:18] Speaker B: All right. I will definitely check it out. Just haven't gotten there yet. [00:57:21] Speaker A: You should. You want to do one? [00:57:25] Speaker B: Sure. Let's see. I watched the Bluff the other day because it had Carl Urban in it. It's a Amazon, the pirate one, isn't it? It's the pirate one with pirate. [00:57:36] Speaker A: I want to say I'm not intrigued because I am intrigued. [00:57:39] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, how could you not be? Right. And I saw there was an. With Priyanka and Carl on GMA and it was charming and. What? Not him. [00:57:50] Speaker A: No, he's not, is he? [00:57:52] Speaker B: No, he's a Kiwi and he's very bad at accents and I love that about him in this one. I think he's supposed to be Irish. [00:57:59] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:58:00] Speaker B: Lord knows he just does his thing. Yeah. So I was like, hey, I mean, how bad could this be? He's a Kiwi. Yes. And it's. It's boring. It's just there's not enough character development in it. It's like. It's all action, but to a degree that you're like, why? You know? And so I was just cut my. I was watching with Kyo. We were just like, this is. This is. We just don't care. And the problem is Karl Urban is the villain, right? But he is extremely hot. Like, this beautiful shaggy gray hair and beard and this tailored pirate outfit and stuff like that. And he's Karl Urban. So you're like. You're waiting the whole movie for it to, like, turn. Like, certainly there's gonna be a part where it turns out he's on, like, the good side or whatever, you know? Like, surely not. And no, he's just, like, a horrible, vile bastard this whole movie. But it's, like, confusing to watch a movie where you're like, that's the guy I like. Like, you know, like, when you watch movies with Carl Urban in them. [00:59:05] Speaker A: Yes. [00:59:06] Speaker B: You're rooting for Carl Urban. So, yeah, it just. Yeah, the bluff was. Was a miss. But at the same time, like, you could put it on while you're scrolling your phone. [00:59:16] Speaker A: Well, it's. It's Amazon, isn't it? So that's what. It's literally what it's made. [00:59:19] Speaker B: Exactly. It's a second screener for sure. So it's not like a. It's bad, but in a way that I'm not like, oh, don't watch this. It's more of a. Like. [00:59:28] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:59:28] Speaker B: Are you doing something else? [00:59:29] Speaker A: I'm certainly raising a new generation of Karl Urban fans. I gotta tell you, the number of times Owen has said to me, dad, we're gonna watch Mortal Kombat 2. Yeah. Because he's seen the trailer is fucking great. In that trailer. [00:59:42] Speaker B: Yes. Oh, you finally have got interest. Are you just catching it from your child now? [00:59:47] Speaker A: Yeah, I like. Listen, I like Caleb. I'm not. I'm not bragging about. [00:59:50] Speaker B: No, no, no. But, like, for the past, like, eight months, every time we've said. I've said something about Mortal Kombat 2, you've said I couldn't. [00:59:59] Speaker A: But no, Owen has got me razed for it. [01:00:02] Speaker B: Yes, Good. Yeah. Because I am so stoked. The trailer looks great, and I really liked the first one, so, you know, I'm on board for it in the first place. But, yeah, it looks great. [01:00:13] Speaker A: Listen, speaking of trailers, super quickly, I really. Somehow I really talked myself into thinking that Evil Dead Rise was gonna be Evil Dead Burn. Sorry, was gonna be this week. I. Trailer. I thought it Would be this week. [01:00:29] Speaker B: You've just. You've created your own timeline. [01:00:31] Speaker A: I have. Soon it's fucking out in June or July. So literally. [01:00:37] Speaker B: So it's gotta be coming any day now. [01:00:39] Speaker A: We're gonna get a trailer for Evil Dead Burn. Any fucking day now. And I can't wait. [01:00:43] Speaker B: Got yourself all worked up over this. [01:00:44] Speaker A: Oh, God, I'm rabid for it. [01:00:47] Speaker B: Yeah, I am looking forward to that. Maybe, hey, if it does come out in June, maybe it'll come out at the same time that I'm there again and we can go see it just like that. [01:00:56] Speaker A: That would be amazing. I'm not gonna wait. I'm not waiting for you, though. [01:01:01] Speaker B: This guy. This fucking guy. Anyways, I also. So this was kind of funny. I have been trying to clear my DVR on my, you know, sling, because right now, like, I have unlimited DVR and that's like five bucks a month. And I'm like, trying to swap things around to be, like, slightly less just for me. [01:01:23] Speaker A: What is Sling? [01:01:25] Speaker B: It's like cable, but it's streaming. [01:01:28] Speaker A: Right. And DVR is the recording functionality. [01:01:31] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. It's just the stuff you record. So you get 50 hours for free, but unlimited for five bucks. And I'm like, this just makes me, like, hoard things instead of watching them. [01:01:42] Speaker A: Makes you watch. [01:01:43] Speaker B: So I just have hoard. What? There is no other way to pronounce that. [01:01:49] Speaker A: That makes me hoard. [01:01:53] Speaker B: How am I supposed to say it? [01:01:55] Speaker A: I don't know. I don't know, but. Sorry. I love it. I love it. [01:01:58] Speaker B: I just hoard things on my dvr. And so I was like, I'm gonna try to, like, go through and like, watch shit on there, and then I can go down to the free dvr. So I've been like, just, like, going through, like, just largely tcm. And the other day, like, there are some that are just daunting. Right. And one of those was Malcolm X. Because that movie is three and a half hours long. [01:02:22] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:02:22] Speaker B: And so there's never like. Yeah, it's never, you know, 8pm And I go, let's pick a movie. And it's gonna be a three and a half hour movie. That's simply not going to happen. But it was like 11 in the morning and I was like, you know what? Now or never. [01:02:37] Speaker A: Can you do a movie in two sittings? I hate doing a movie in two sittings. [01:02:40] Speaker B: Absolutely not. Nope. If I abandon it, it's done. This, that happened with Primate, that I watched half of it and then the feed cut out. [01:02:47] Speaker A: Okay. [01:02:48] Speaker B: And I couldn't get it to start again. I was like, that's done. [01:02:51] Speaker A: Not gonna watch it and no harm was done, right? [01:02:54] Speaker B: Yeah. I don't feel like I missed much there, but so I was like, all right, I'm gonna sit and I'm gonna watch Malcolm X. And I realized I have seen Malcolm X when I was a very young child probably, you know, it came out when I was seven, so I would wager when I was seven or eight years old, I saw this. And there have been all these scenes that have traumatized me my entire life that I didn't know where they came from and they were from Malcolm X. Such as there's a scene where a guy's tied to a train track with a train coming at him and he's gonna get split in half by this train while he's, like, screaming. That I have thought about my entire life. Like, it will, like, literally come up in dreams. There's the death of Malcolm X as he's just, like, absolutely riddled by people shooting him at point blank range. There's just like all these different scenes throughout this movie that, like, I'm like, this has been in my mind. [01:03:57] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. [01:03:57] Speaker B: For the past 30 years. But I didn't know where they came from. It was Malcolm X. So that was an interesting experience to watch something like, for the first time as I thought it and be like, oh, no, this movie has followed me my entire life. I also didn't think it was that good, but I think, you know, it's. It's tough. I don't think I really like vibe with Spike Lee joints in general. It's just not a director that I [01:04:24] Speaker A: have a lot of affinity for. Yeah, same, same. [01:04:29] Speaker B: And in a. From a political perspective, on top of the artistic perspective, I think he kind of tends to be a little bit of a liberal. And so the Malcolm X of this movie is a little watered down from, like, who the actual guy was. So you don't get like all the, like, anti capitalism and stuff like that in this. And then it, like, ends with, like, just cheesiness, like, bringing this to the modern thing. And you've got all these little kids in a classroom going, I'm Malcolm X. I'm Malcolm X. And you're like, oh, Jesus Christ. [01:05:00] Speaker A: Yikes. [01:05:01] Speaker B: Oh, this is embarrassing. So I was a little surprised that I was like, this, you know, doesn't work for me. But it was interesting also to revisit that many of my nightmares for the past few years. [01:05:18] Speaker A: Let me see. I'll. I'll Talk briefly of the Ballad of Wallace Island. [01:05:26] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, because you really liked that, huh? [01:05:28] Speaker A: Again, I. Maybe there's something I need to confront. Maybe there's something I need to talk out. Maybe I do. I cry too easily in movies because this was another crier. I am. I am. I am. I really appreciate sincerity in film these days. I really appreciate as an adult, as a man who is nearing. I soon will die, right? I'm gonna be dead soon. I'm nearing the end of my life. [01:05:57] Speaker B: Soon is the right word. [01:05:58] Speaker A: And I yearn. I yearn for someone to almost like killing me softly. I yearn to see my truth repeated back to me. I need to see someone who gets it. I needed. I love a movie that fucking gets it. And Wallace Island. It's all there. Everything. All of the. All of the. Everything that I wanted and felt. The moment I watched that movie was just like gazing into a mirror. It's so sincere, this think about the banshees of Inisher in, right, this film that deals with just the questions and the unfulfilled need, the ellipsis, the kind of the wondering of life, the kind of the unanswered questions and the wharfs and the never was, this need for closure and for truth, this. This yearning that everyone fucking has at some point in their life. It's all there in Wallace island, the questioning. Am I wrong here? Am I the fucking idiot? Am I not getting life? Is life eluding me? Am I? You know, what if I'd done this? Will I ever do that? Will I ever fucking feel complete? What is it? What is the fucking piece that I need to make me feel fucking whole, right? Those are the kinds of questions that you get from this fucking film. And it's just. It was just the right fucking movie at the right time. It's so. I don't really like Tim Key as a performer. Really? [01:07:35] Speaker B: I don't know who that is. [01:07:36] Speaker A: Yeah, you do. You know, if you. If you saw him, he's a British comic actor, okay? Google him and you'll know him immediately. [01:07:47] Speaker B: All right, Let me. Let me. [01:07:49] Speaker A: Tim Tee stood next to him at a bar once. [01:07:53] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [01:07:54] Speaker A: Went to see a comedy festival in Machanleth, and he was in the pub. [01:07:58] Speaker B: He looks vaguely familiar. I couldn't, like, place him from anything, but he looks. [01:08:06] Speaker A: You know, it's just about a guy who invites a band that he loves to play on the island. [01:08:11] Speaker B: Oh, he's in Mickey 17. [01:08:13] Speaker A: Yeah. Known more recently over here as being a big part of the current phase of Alan Partridge. [01:08:20] Speaker B: Yes, I do see that on here as well. I didn't know there was a current phase of Alan Partridge. [01:08:24] Speaker A: Oh, listen, don't get me fucking started. Don't get me started on Alan podcast. Please don't get me started. Right? [01:08:34] Speaker B: I'm not doing it. [01:08:35] Speaker A: There is no other British comedic creation that comes fucking close to Alan Partridge in the longevity and the continuity and the character development. Alan has been through so many phases of his career, right. And so many people have had a crack at writing him and they've all got it right. He's been fucking brilliant. [01:08:56] Speaker B: When you said don't get me started, I was like, oh, no. Is this. [01:08:59] Speaker A: Oh, in a good way. In a good way. [01:09:01] Speaker B: Okay, right. [01:09:02] Speaker A: We have followed Alan throughout his life is his career as a local radio DJ to presenting sports with Chris on the day to day to his own TV show. You know, knowing me, knowing you, and the catastrophes and the calamities that he's endured, all of his own doing. [01:09:19] Speaker B: I think I've seen most of the old phases. [01:09:22] Speaker A: Just incomparable work of fucking character comedy. Alan Partridge has never been a fucking creation. [01:09:29] Speaker B: Like, great stuff, Amazing. Okay, well, all right. I didn't get you started. You got yourself started. [01:09:36] Speaker A: Let the record show, I'm known for doing that. [01:09:39] Speaker B: Yes. [01:09:41] Speaker A: All right. Prime. It will skip. [01:09:44] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Nothing to really say about that. [01:09:47] Speaker A: How little is it possible to care about a group of people in a movie? [01:09:51] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, just, you know, one thing I will say about this, just to give you that sense, is that, like, there's like a love interest in this movie. And it's like they just kill him, like immediately, unceremoniously. Like he just falls headfirst off a cliff and dies. And you're like, what's this movie about? Nah, I don't understand. What? Understand nothing. [01:10:13] Speaker A: To root for no one to get behind. [01:10:15] Speaker B: Not at all. It's hard to get behind a movie that's like, got such a sad premise too. Like, oh, the house pet becomes, like, just a sociopathic murderer because it has rabies. [01:10:27] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. [01:10:29] Speaker B: What do you do with that? [01:10:31] Speaker A: It's not the monkey's fault. [01:10:32] Speaker B: There's no happy ending to this. The happiest thing that can happen is monkey dies. [01:10:36] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Well, monkey gets better. [01:10:39] Speaker B: Yeah. Or monkey doesn't happen with rabies. So, yeah, just from the premise, not so much. [01:10:46] Speaker A: And again, just all. I can't get more and more right. And this is probably your fault. I can't get behind huge displays of privilege in characters and just. [01:11:01] Speaker B: Yeah, I probably have ruined you for that, haven't I, Rich? And everyone's fucking. [01:11:05] Speaker A: Nobody's got any real. The only problems these people have got is a monkey trying to eat them. [01:11:10] Speaker B: Yeah, that's your only one up until that point. Life was perfect. [01:11:13] Speaker A: Nah, not. Not interested in you. Show me some real struggle. [01:11:18] Speaker B: If you're the kind of person that can have a pet monkey in your backyard. I mean, we are not the same. [01:11:24] Speaker A: Yeah. I don't know if I've mentioned this before, but as a kid, fuck. This sounds fake, but it's true. So there was me and at one point my three brothers and my mum and dad. Right. Living in a fucking council house in Tritiga in South Wales. Right. [01:11:42] Speaker B: Okay. [01:11:43] Speaker A: And literally two doors down on our street, there was a family who had a fucking pet monkey for a bit. What? I shit you not. I think it was only for like a couple of weeks. [01:11:56] Speaker B: What kind of monkey? [01:11:57] Speaker A: Oh, it was this little tiny thing. [01:12:00] Speaker B: Uh huh. [01:12:01] Speaker A: And they kept it in a fucking cage and it stank. [01:12:04] Speaker B: Yeah, I can imagine. [01:12:06] Speaker A: And they didn't have it for long and it was. Must have been awful for the monkey. They were a fucking shitty family as well. [01:12:13] Speaker B: That's the only people who end up with pets like that. [01:12:15] Speaker A: Yeah. With a pet monkey. [01:12:16] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:12:17] Speaker A: So what do you think of that? [01:12:19] Speaker B: That's something else, buddy. [01:12:20] Speaker A: What do you fucking think of that? [01:12:25] Speaker B: This has been Tales of Wales with Mark Lewis. Oh, by the way, when you were describing Wallace island just this week, put on your list to watch. What's that Oscar nominated movie that you need to watch about the fella. It's. Oh my gosh, give me one second. I'm gonna look at the Oscar nominated Oscar nominated this year's Oscar. This year's Oscars. [01:12:58] Speaker A: I swear. [01:13:00] Speaker B: Train Dreams. [01:13:01] Speaker A: Train Dreams, yes, Train Dreams. Not hear of it, but I will. [01:13:05] Speaker B: Yes, you have because I told you all about it and you were like, [01:13:07] Speaker A: I would love to watch that. Yeah. When I was talking about taxi drivers and they don't taxi driving. They don't make them like they used to. That film. [01:13:14] Speaker B: Sure, maybe. [01:13:16] Speaker A: Okay. [01:13:17] Speaker B: Train Dreams is, you know, it's a very slow. I described it as meditative movie about life and death and tragedy and you know, just ruminating on how miserable but how beautiful life is. And it's really, really good and I think that you're gonna connect with it a lot. [01:13:38] Speaker A: I can't wait. I really, really, really will watch that and I'm really looking forward to it. [01:13:41] Speaker B: It's very up your alley, I think. I watched Falling down one that's been on my list for a very long time. [01:13:50] Speaker A: Poor one. Out for Robert Duvall. [01:13:53] Speaker B: Yes. That was why it was like, oh, let's watch a Robert Duvall movie. Yeah. And I was, like, looking through, and I was like, you know what? I've never seen Falling Down. And I was like, all right, yeah, let's watch that then. [01:14:04] Speaker A: Sweaty. Sweaty. [01:14:06] Speaker B: Well, and we were talking about this because we watched. It was Predator 2. We watched Predator 2. We'll get to that. But I was saying this is like two movies from the early 90s in LA, and it's before everyone had AC everywhere or whatever. And both movies are just drenched. [01:14:25] Speaker A: Absolutely. [01:14:26] Speaker B: The whole time. Yeah. And it really gives you this. It heightens the sense of everything that's going on. [01:14:32] Speaker A: Right. [01:14:32] Speaker B: You can understand why people crack when they're feeling like this. This whole. But Falling down was like, I loved it. So good. Such a good satire that then when you read the letterboxd reviews, you realize people don't get it on either side because there's a lot of, like, lefty people on it that are like, oh, this just, you know, elevates male grievance and blah, blah, blah, blah. And then there's people on the right that are like, you know, yeah, this is what we're driven to, and blah, blah, blah. It's like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. He's not the good guy. He says it at the end. He says, am I the bad guy? And he has a realization that, like, everything he's done, he's thought was out of, like, you know, oh, I deserve this and that, and it's. It's bad. How does everyone on both sides not see what this movie is saying? [01:15:26] Speaker A: It's very difficult for me. The Joel Schumacher of Falling down, the Joel Schumacher of Batman and Robin. Very. [01:15:36] Speaker B: You know, Joel Schumacher is a gay man who has all of the layers of. You know, what that means to him. And I think this is just different reflections I see of that. You know, different expressions of the sides of him. Right. It's like, this is a guy containing multitudes, and all of it is very queer. [01:16:02] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:16:03] Speaker B: But it depends on how you're looking at it. [01:16:05] Speaker A: Fine. [01:16:07] Speaker B: I watched Keono. I watched another one that I can't. I'm not even gonna try to remember the name of. But it had Philip Seymour Hoffman, another Joel Schumacher movie, and Robert De Niro. And Robert De Niro plays, like, this bigot, and Philip Seymour Hoffman plays a trans woman, and he ends up, like, basically helping Robert De Niro with Like speech therapy by teaching him to sing, essentially. [01:16:34] Speaker A: I've seen that. And like you, I can't remember what it's called, but I've seen. [01:16:37] Speaker B: Yeah, I don't remember what it's called. You know, Philip Seymour Hoffman is great, all this stuff. But it was like, watching it, I was like, you can tell. This was like, actually, despite how, you know, any kind of movie like that or Philadelphia or things like that, that are like, you know, Queer Person teaches bigot how to, like, understand him. Like, it's obviously problematic, right? But the voice of the movie was very clearly a queer man making it. You know, it's like, this is insider stuff right here. Who is making this? And so, like, I think that that's something that, like, when you recognize work, [01:17:10] Speaker A: career, like I had, you know. [01:17:12] Speaker B: Yeah, it's all over the place. But, you know, you can see what, like, his passions are and what he's trying to, like, get across to people in his work and so falling down. I think, you know, if you think that it was made by like, some CIS het. Centrist guy, that's a great point. [01:17:29] Speaker A: Conduct. [01:17:29] Speaker B: It's gonna be a different movie than when you see it through the eyes of, you know, a gay man critiquing toxic masculinity before that was a phrase anybody used, you know, Great. So I thought. [01:17:41] Speaker A: You are talking about Flawless, by the way. [01:17:44] Speaker B: Flawless. That was what it was called. [01:17:45] Speaker A: Yes. [01:17:46] Speaker B: Never would have remembered that was the name. Yeah, it's a. It's good if problematic, you know, there's two guys, Philip Seymour Hoffman and Robert De Niro, who. It's real hard to not enjoy watching them act. What else you got? [01:18:02] Speaker A: All right. We must. We must, of course, talk about. Send help. [01:18:05] Speaker B: Send help, of course. Yes. [01:18:07] Speaker A: No. [01:18:09] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:18:09] Speaker A: You're seeing Sent help. I hope. I hope. If you're listening to this, you would have seen Sent Help by now. I hope you would have. [01:18:15] Speaker B: And let's not spoil too hard. [01:18:17] Speaker A: No, certainly not. Certainly not. [01:18:19] Speaker B: We don't want to ruin the Raimi for people. [01:18:21] Speaker A: Certainly not. But I hope you put your ass in a fucking seat to watch this movie. Because it isn't often that this happens. It isn't often that Sam Raimi goes. Gives us what we want. He always. No, I'll rephrase that. He always gives us what we want, but he doesn't always give us what we want. He gives us what he wants to give us, which is much the same thing, but he doesn't always give us what we think we fucking want, which is mainline mid column. Mid to right column, you know, Nice chewy, gross, fucking slapstick horror. And that's what this is. Apparently. It's done brilliant business. [01:19:05] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean it seems like everyone's seen it. And yeah, like the way that I put this movie is that like I didn't particularly like it, but it had nothing to do with the movie itself. [01:19:16] Speaker A: Right. [01:19:16] Speaker B: The movie does everything it's supposed to do. [01:19:19] Speaker A: Right. [01:19:20] Speaker B: I for one, I mean, and this is a good thing. I was like closing my eyes for like most of the movie. It's like, it's too gory for me, which again, that's fine. That's not a thing that turns me off of a movie. I don't mind closing my eyes, but I definitely had my eyes closed for a good chunk of this. My thing is just that like I'm not a huge fan of movies where like both characters are really obnoxious. [01:19:43] Speaker A: Right. [01:19:44] Speaker B: And that was kind of my issue here, was that I was just like, I just don't want to watch these people exist anymore. And it's what they're supposed to be in the movie. So it is not about this being bad in any way. It is about that. Like personally I can't sit through a movie where I want to punch both people in the face the whole time. [01:20:04] Speaker A: Okay. I mean I'll, I'll, I'll repeat here what I've said to you in private. I, I feel I rated sent out partially. I gave it three and a half and I think, I think I should have given it a 4 because it is such fun in that it's one of those films where you, you don't look at your watch once. It is breakneck paced, it is funny, it is just the gore is paced beautifully. Just when you think you're comfortable in the film and just when you decide, all right, let's just chill out, stretch out and just wait. Just when you think you're safe in the film, it surprises you with again, comic book fucking Sam Raimi. Perfect slapstick, but brutality, you know? [01:20:55] Speaker B: Right. [01:20:57] Speaker A: You're right about both the leads because it's essentially, it's largely a two hander, isn't it? You've got two fucking people mostly in this entire movie, which in itself is gripping. I love that. But what I think you don't like Corey, right? What I think, what I think you can't handle, right? And I'm pointing at the screen here, listeners, right? [01:21:18] Speaker B: I'm jabbing very accusatory. [01:21:20] Speaker A: Accusatory finger my zoom window here. I don't think you're comfortable with ambiguity. That's what I think the problem is. [01:21:30] Speaker B: This guy has the audacity to say, [01:21:34] Speaker A: and you can't handle that sometimes. [01:21:38] Speaker B: You think me, who just raved about falling down, [01:21:43] Speaker A: I think. Right. I don't think you're comfortable with complexity in your character as either. Right. Because our allegiances flip between these two lads during this film. [01:21:56] Speaker B: Oh, my allegiances never flipped. It was, they should both die. [01:22:00] Speaker A: Well, I think you realize that there was a little bit more challenge in Sam Raimi's just horror comedy center for me, you know, And I think you retreated from it. I think it stopped you from engaging with it fully on its own terms because you don't like ambiguity. [01:22:16] Speaker B: Mmm. Yeah, it's a, it's a flaw of mine, you know, I require. I think you'd like it to be a clear cut. You would like it to be handed [01:22:23] Speaker A: to you, don't you? And Samurami's not gonna do that. Right. Yeah, look, send help is fantastic. Yeah. [01:22:32] Speaker B: What I've still recommend it. Like, the only reason that I didn't enjoy it is just because I don't enjoy annoying characters. But it is very much like everything that you just said. It's funny and it's got surprising gore and it's, you know, moves at a good clip and all of that kind of stuff. And this is just simply one hang up that I have in something. And everyone else is going to enjoy this, I think. [01:22:55] Speaker A: Yeah, it's, it's, it's very much in the mold of Drag Me to Hell, which again has characters that you're not really supposed to 100% like, doesn't it? Drag Me to Hell. Have you not seen Drag Me to Hell? [01:23:08] Speaker B: No, I think we, I think we talked about this recently. Yeah, I've still never seen that because it's a very silly reason. Maybe, maybe I said this on Blue Sky. Actually, I think it was on Blue Sky. I was talking about this, but that one of the, like, promotional posters for this had the character literally being dragged to hell and she has her fingers clawing the ground as she's pulled. And that's a thing that I can't stand. I don't like fingernails breaking. [01:23:35] Speaker A: Sure, I know this. Yeah, I know this. [01:23:37] Speaker B: And thus I have just never been able to like, get myself to watch the movie. And people have said, like, I'm not even sure if that ever happens in it. And I'm like, I don't think it does. [01:23:45] Speaker A: Eyes pop out, there's lots of bodily fluids. [01:23:47] Speaker B: That's fine. I'm okay with that. I just can't do fingernails. That's. That's a thing I don't like. And so it's just one stupid poster 20 years ago, 25 years ago, that has made it so I've never seen Lots of fun. [01:24:00] Speaker A: I would encourage you to confront that and to watch Dragon. [01:24:03] Speaker B: Yeah, I should. [01:24:03] Speaker A: It's a. It's a hell of a laugh. [01:24:06] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:24:07] Speaker A: As is Send help. So if you haven't seen it already, you really ought to. And you know what? [01:24:11] Speaker B: You really gotta, gotta see crime 101. [01:24:16] Speaker A: Oh yeah, go on. [01:24:17] Speaker B: Delightful. Went and saw this on the big screen and this is just a motion picture, my friend. Thank God I had. [01:24:25] Speaker A: By anyone of note. [01:24:26] Speaker B: I don't know, I actually don't know who directed it, but it has. Chris Hemsworth is the lead, has Halle Berry, Mark Ruffalo, hell of a cast all the way through. And it's basically about. Mark Ruffalo is a cop, a very Columbo esque cop. You know, that's what they were going for. He drives a beater. No one takes him seriously, that kind of thing. And he has a theory that all of these robberies that have been happening are being done by the same guy along the 101 freeway in California. And he's like, no one ever gets hurt. You know, it's always within X amount of space from the 101, all that kind of stuff. And he's like, I'm sure it's the same guy. And everybody else is like you, it's not. You're making up stuff. And meanwhile Chris Hemsworth is that thief who is robbing all these like high end places without hurting anybody. All of this stuff and getting away with it. So you're following both of them, them. And meanwhile Halle Berry is this character who's, you know, she ensures high end shit like the stuff that he steals. And it has become clear that due to misogyny and ageism in her job, she is never going to get the promotion that she was promised. And now this sort of leads into this web of like, you know, collaborating and crime and all this stuff. And it is just fun from beginning to end. Chris Hemsworth plays like a very unusual Chris Hemsworth character because he's a little like awkward and anxious and stuff like that. Like he puts on smoothness when he's like in the zone, but he's like kind of a little like introvert and whatnot otherwise. And like everything about it is just so much fun. [01:26:10] Speaker A: See, it's left me Entirely unengaged. I've seen the trailer about 50,000 times, but until you just said that Ruffalo plays like a kind of a Columbo. [01:26:21] Speaker B: A Columbo? Yeah, he's. [01:26:23] Speaker A: I suddenly really want to see it because it's received wisdom by now that Mark Ruffalo has to play Columbo in a reboot. [01:26:28] Speaker B: Yeah, like, you know, they leaned into that. They were like, we've heard everybody say that. Let's have him. Beautiful, basically. And he is absolutely wonderful in this movie. Big recommend it. It's just a movie, you know, it's not gonna make you think super hard about anything. You're just gonna sit there and enjoy a movie. [01:26:49] Speaker A: Right? Okay, I look forward. I'm not gonna pay for it, but I'm. I am gonna steal that. [01:26:54] Speaker B: It's really fun on the big screen, but I know you're not gonna. Gonna do that, but other people, if it's in your local theater, I would recommend it on the big screen because it's big. It's got, like, four car chases in it. It's a blast. [01:27:06] Speaker A: Wonderful. Really, really nice. Really nicely put. You. [01:27:09] Speaker B: Oh, also, what's his face? Who's. Who's the Irish kid with the fucked up face who dated Sabrina Carpenter? [01:27:16] Speaker A: I don't know. [01:27:17] Speaker B: Barry Keoghan. [01:27:18] Speaker A: All right. [01:27:19] Speaker B: Yeah, he is. [01:27:20] Speaker A: Is that how you pronounce his name in it? [01:27:22] Speaker B: Yes, it's Keoghan. [01:27:23] Speaker A: Okay. [01:27:24] Speaker B: I know it's. It's confusing as a Vaughn that he has all the same letters as my name, but it is not pronounced like that. [01:27:32] Speaker A: Thank you. [01:27:33] Speaker B: But, yes, he's in it. Being crazy as well. He's like the wild card thief guy in it, too, so gotta have it. It's fun. [01:27:40] Speaker A: Yeah, I'll speak of Southbound. [01:27:44] Speaker B: Ah, yeah. You finally watched Southbound. Satanya. You hear that? He finally watched. [01:27:49] Speaker A: Oh, my goodness. Watched Southbound. Having completely forgotten that you'd been recommending it to me for years. [01:27:56] Speaker B: Yes, Laurie, too. Laurie is many times recommended. [01:28:00] Speaker A: Yes, Laurie, you. You were right. Corrigan was right. You were both right. Look, what a thrill it is. What a thrill it is to see horror that is just full of fucking ideas. That is full of just intrigue and surprise. We have an anthology movie here, but an anthology movie that every chapter is almost incomplete. Do you know what I'm saying? I don't know how well you remember Southbound, but yeah, we follow two guys and a fucking dusty highway. You know what I mean? And they encounter different stories along the way, but none of the stories are complete. It's like we see the beginnings of a tale in progress. Yeah, we see the, the middle of a tale in progress, but never. Nothing is wrapped up. Just progressively more fucked up situations. So inventive. Each chapter is almost like its own subgenre. There's cosmic in there, there's home invasion in there, there's griblies, there's really fucking fun. Just so, so, so surprising gore. Oh, man, I loved Southbound. It is so atmospheric. I was genuinely taken aback, like. [01:29:25] Speaker B: Yeah, I had the same reaction seeing it. Just like, holy shit. [01:29:28] Speaker A: Yeah, it's. It's the kind. [01:29:30] Speaker B: I've never seen something like this before. [01:29:32] Speaker A: It's the kind of horror movie that I would wear a T shirt of. [01:29:34] Speaker B: Yeah, totally. [01:29:37] Speaker A: For sure. I loved Southbound again. Dripping. Absolutely dripping. That was this one bit, right, that I think I'll remember forever. And it's the cosmic phase. It's the cosmic chapter where a guy goes to rescue his sister after she's been missing for like a decade or whatever and finds her involved in some cult. And she hasn't aged a day, but the rest of the world has aged. And these cultists have like, they're covered in self penned tattoos and there's just such a brief throwaway moment. You know, I love huge ideas that are just picked up and cast away. [01:30:09] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:30:09] Speaker A: And it's what I mean when I say this film follows stories in progress. This guy has got a tattoo of an eye on the back of his hand and he puts it up to his. To his face like this. And both his real eye and the tattoo blink at the same time. Oh, God, it's so good. Oh, Southbound is great. It's the kind of horror movie that is, is. It's, it's that kind of horror movie that is. Was formative for me as a kid. Right. [01:30:37] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:30:38] Speaker A: I had the same thrill of watching South Bend as I had at 16 or 17. You know, watching the classics, the Cronenbergs and whatnot. Blinding stuff. Really, really fucking cool. [01:30:48] Speaker B: Love it. The only other things that I watched aside from you, and then we can, you know, see what you have and then get to what we watch together. I did watch the New Anaconda. In fact, I watched both Anacondas and as you predicted, I did enjoy it. Great time with it. Yeah, it's just, it's just stupid and fun and I like everyone in it. I think Tendi Way Newton is just so delightful in that movie that I just like, I just wanted to be her best friend. I loved her to pieces in it. Yeah. Not gonna, not gonna change any lives or Anything. But I had a fun time with it, you know. [01:31:31] Speaker A: All right. [01:31:33] Speaker B: I did not have the experience you had with it. I also watched the old Anaconda and come on, everybody loves Anaconda. It's ridiculous. And much like he would Drag Me [01:31:45] Speaker A: to Hell, you know, I don't think I've seen it. [01:31:48] Speaker B: You never seen the original Anaconda? [01:31:50] Speaker A: I don't think so. [01:31:51] Speaker B: We gotta make that a watch along. Maybe that's this month's watch along, because this is. Oh, if you have not experienced Jon Voight in Anaconda, you really have not. [01:32:02] Speaker A: Okay. I was thinking the same about Drag Me to Hell, you know, I was thinking maybe we could make Drag Me to Hell. [01:32:06] Speaker B: I've got a couple watch alongs lined up here. We do, yeah. Absolute necessity. So we'll put that on. And then the other thing that I watched that was not with you, but that I know you have watched. I finally watched Begonia. [01:32:19] Speaker A: Oh, please tell me you liked it. [01:32:21] Speaker B: Yeah, it was a delight. I had a good time with it. Yeah. [01:32:24] Speaker A: Okay. [01:32:24] Speaker B: I mean, what's not to like about that movie? [01:32:27] Speaker A: I don't know, but you tend to. You'll find something. [01:32:32] Speaker B: No, in this case, this. Again, I kind of feel similarly, in a funny way to this about crime 101, where this is not a movie that, like, is going to change your life in any way. It has, you know, some things to say about stuff. You know, there's political threads throughout this whole thing, obviously because of, you know, the basis of this being kind of a guy who being screwed over by his sort of Amazon, like, work and the way that they have, like, it's a big pharma company that has left his mother hospitalized. And, you know, so you're dealing with a lot of class and political issues and things like that. But overall, like, the movie itself is just like a fun story that is extremely well acted by everyone involved in it, including. I am shocked. This kid only was nominated for one award, but the autistic cousin is legitimately autistic and is fantastic in this movie. Just great comedic timing. Just very sympathetic, you know, someone you really genuinely care about. Pretty much immediately, totally in this movie. Yeah. It's just like, I had such a fun time with it. And then afterwards I was like, why is it called begonia? Spelled wrong? And that's when I found out it's not a flower, like a bogonia, but like a ritual involving bees. [01:33:58] Speaker A: I did not know that. What about that ending, huh? [01:34:02] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, just delightful. You know, unfortunately, I will say, because I Saw it so late. The original trailers did not give anything away about it. The new trailers that they show for it kind of give away the twist at the end of it, but it's still fucking fun. [01:34:21] Speaker A: I'm delighted. I'm delighted you enjoyed it. How could you not? I'll talk briefly about a movie called Atroz, right? [01:34:30] Speaker B: What? [01:34:30] Speaker A: Atroz. A T R O Z. The English title is Atrocious. [01:34:36] Speaker B: Oh, okay, got it. Translate. I was like, I don't know that word. Now I'm with you. [01:34:42] Speaker A: How to contextualize this? It doesn't happen often, but from time to time I require a gut check, right? And Atrocious is terrible. Okay, okay, terrible. It is worthless, but it is. It is of the same vein as something like Cannibal Holocaust or something like a Serbian film, right? It is that. It's something like. It is one of those on the fringe. It goes that far. And I will always, like, you know, I will always champion films that decide they have to go to that place, Right. Doesn't make them good movies. [01:35:33] Speaker B: Right? [01:35:34] Speaker A: But someone has to be doing that. I firmly. I will. I will fucking cling to that with my cold, dead hands. Someone has to be exploring those parts of art, right? [01:35:46] Speaker B: They. [01:35:46] Speaker A: You have to do it now. [01:35:48] Speaker B: It doesn't mean it's great, but I'll allow it. [01:35:50] Speaker A: It doesn't mean that it's any good, because this isn't. It is, you know, exploitative, the stories for what it is. It's. It's also an anthology movie. A cop in Mexico at the scene of a crash, car crash, finds a camcorder tape with the most horrific crimes possible from these two guys who are in it. And it's terrible. But I thought, right, can I watch this and gauge my reactions just to see how I'm doing psychologically? And I'll be honest with you, right after watching this, I went on, which is something I haven't done in a few years, and I found myself a cartel killing video to watch, right. Just to check in on how I'm doing. And I watched a video of a guy getting his arms cut off and shot in the head. And luckily it was awful. [01:36:49] Speaker B: Oh, good luck. Glad to hear it. [01:36:52] Speaker A: Luckily, it haunted me for days afterwards. So that's good. [01:36:56] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. Proper response. Yeah. Can't close your eyes without seeing that. [01:37:01] Speaker A: Oh, it's terrible. Terrible, terrible, terrible. But, yeah, so. So that's good. I'm fine. [01:37:09] Speaker B: Very glad to hear that. Oh, there is one more thing that I wanted to bring up, actually. The Bad Seed this is another DVR clearer. This is one of my TCM watches. This is a 1960s movie, but I think you would enjoy this one because it very, very much feels like a stage play. And it's about a little girl who is basically a sociopath, but she's like a cute little blonde girl with braids who, you know, lives in this respectable family and stuff like that, but basically her class goes on a trip somewhere, and a boy in the class drowns. And over the course of this, you realize that she did it, and it's probably not her first murder. Yeah. And so, you know, it's the 60s, so you don't see anything. Everything is very psychological in this, and. And basically, her mother is kind of spiraling. Being the person who is realizing this is happening and trying to figure out, is this my fault? Like, what. What happened? What's going on with her, like, being in denial about it. Like, you know, it's just this. It. Most of it. There's some parts of it that takes place in, like, the backyard, but the vast majority of this takes place in, like, the parlor of love. [01:38:29] Speaker A: Love that. [01:38:30] Speaker B: With, like, people coming in and out. Right. Like, her dad comes to visit, and then a friend comes to visit, and then the. The mother of the. The child who drowned comes in drunk. And, like, it's very much just, like, everything revolving through this, and it's creepy and interesting and kind of dealing with, like, the. It talks about, like, true crime in this. Basically not using that term, but, like, true crime is becoming popular at this point. And, you know, there's different theories, kind of nature versus nurture, theories about, like, what makes someone do terrible things. And so it's kind of grappling with this, you know, in the 1960s. Yeah. The bad Seed is. Is a classic for a reason. It's a. It's a good one, and I recommend it. [01:39:14] Speaker A: Thank you. [01:39:14] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:39:16] Speaker A: Thank you. I suspect that'll be, like, a cell phone that I'll. I'll pick up in four or five years. [01:39:22] Speaker B: Right. [01:39:22] Speaker A: But I will get to it. Like, a fantastic. I'll get there. I always get there. [01:39:27] Speaker B: It's worthwhile. I think it really hits just some things that you really like. [01:39:31] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Real nice. [01:39:34] Speaker B: We watched a couple together. [01:39:36] Speaker A: We did. Why don't we talk of rhymes for young ghouls? [01:39:42] Speaker B: Indeed. Obviously, you know, at the start of this year, I was like. Last year's movies were too white, and I'm sick of white people's opinions on things. So I'm gonna try to watch more Stuff by people of color. And so I found this movie called Rhymes for Young Ghouls on a list of like indigenous horror and thriller movies. This is. Was like 2015, 2016 somewhere in that [01:40:11] Speaker A: general of the semitia thereabouts. Yes. [01:40:14] Speaker B: Yeah. And it deals with the residential schools that existed throughout Canada and the United States. This is particularly in Canada. And deals with these people on a reservation who are being tormented by the residential school and the white man who runs that residential school who makes everything miserable for everybody. And it's very violent and rapey and all that kind of stuff. And so these kids and adults are dealing with all of that while also the sort of structural things that happen on reservations because of years of colonial. Colonialism and, you know, dealing with being oppressed by that. So alcohol and you know, crime and stuff like that that is thriving on this reservation as well. And boy, it goes hard. Pretty much out the gate. [01:41:09] Speaker A: Yeah, it does. It's relentless. [01:41:10] Speaker B: It is, yeah, it's relentless. [01:41:13] Speaker A: But I don't know about you, but there is a begrudging kind of authentic kind of humor in the whole thing. It is kind of the struggle. People kind of so embedded in the structural struggle that they fucking live and sleep within every fucking day. The struggle. The struggle. And there's a sort of a grim likeability about. About everybody in it, even the fucking. Even. Even those who are doing horrible things. The indigenous cast are super, super relatable somehow. [01:41:53] Speaker B: Yeah, very much so, yeah. Super well written film. Unfortunately, the fellow who wrote and directed it has died. Died of cancer, which is unfortunate. He clearly had a promising career in front of him. But it's brutal, it's sad and tragic, but like you said, also has very, you know, funny moments. And, you know, it is really. It's relentless. It's people who every single moment of their life is struggle and how they, you know, work within that. And yeah, I, I quite. I don't know, enjoy is maybe the wrong word. [01:42:28] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:42:28] Speaker B: But I recommend rhymes for young ghouls. I think, you know, we're still exposing how terrible the residential schools were for people. And it's recent history that people do not understand. And so I think it does a really good job of really presenting the horrors of what it was like to attend one of these schools in the 1960s. [01:42:51] Speaker A: Yeah, totally agree. Is. Is. Is the background in that movie then, where the guy who made it came from? [01:43:01] Speaker B: It's a. It's a fictional reservation. It's a fictional Micmac reservation, I believe. But yeah, I mean, like, I would imagine probably his Parents were a school like this. You know, a lot of indigenous people who are, you know, millennials, Gen X, their parents were in these schools. Very born of reality. [01:43:26] Speaker A: Yeah, it was great. And. And one of those movies I would literally never have come across my. [01:43:32] Speaker B: Yeah, it has Devrie Jacobs from Reservation Dogs, and she's incredible. So recommend that for her as well. [01:43:41] Speaker A: Yeah, really, really cool. And we will close out. [01:43:46] Speaker B: Hmm. [01:43:48] Speaker A: I. I know I'm certain I said this last time we spoke of this particular series, but if I'm having a Predator moment, it seems to be going on for a few years now. I'm a big Predator guy. What was that? [01:44:05] Speaker B: I accidentally hit a tab and so it got really bright. All of a sudden. [01:44:11] Speaker A: Your face just got burned off. I'm a big Predator guy. Right. And I don't know. I don't know why. Why did the urge take me to watch Predator 2? [01:44:17] Speaker B: He's a big Predator guy. [01:44:19] Speaker A: Big Predator guy. Why did the urge Grabby to watch Predator 2? Was it me or was it you [01:44:25] Speaker B: who suggested it was you? Yeah, you very much were like, hey, tonight we're watching Predator 2. [01:44:31] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:44:32] Speaker B: Okay. [01:44:33] Speaker A: Hadn't seen it ever, ever, ever since the 90s when it came out. [01:44:38] Speaker B: Yeah. This was really surprising to me because obviously I rewatched all of them, you know, two years ago or whatever, and I did not realize that you had not encountered this when I was like. [01:44:50] Speaker A: And you know what? The more I think, the more I'm not convinced I've ever seen it properly. I think I might have seen it on, like, a vhs, [01:44:58] Speaker B: so. [01:44:58] Speaker A: Like a VHS bootleg of it, I think. Like an old cinema cam job on a VHS when I was like a kid. Like a proper kid. [01:45:05] Speaker B: Right. [01:45:07] Speaker A: So imagine then my shock. Imagine my surprise at seeing Predator 2. [01:45:13] Speaker B: And, yeah, if you've seen Predator 2, you know, it is not like Predator. [01:45:20] Speaker A: But it is, though. [01:45:21] Speaker B: Like, in some ways it is. But what was your. Your comparison? It was like Robocop to. [01:45:29] Speaker A: Yes, I think. I think I nailed it in calling it RoboCop 2 to RoboCop, as opposed to Aliens to Alien. [01:45:36] Speaker B: Right, Exactly. [01:45:37] Speaker A: It doesn't take what you loved about the first film and build on it and improve on it. Absolutely not. It takes what you're expecting that sequel to do and wrong foot you and go into goofier, but also none less valid territory. Right. And it knows what you're expecting visually. Right. The movie starts by panning through what you assume to be jungle, and you're like, oh, cool, okay, it's Predator 2. But then ah. Visually, cinematically, pulls the rug out from under you and takes us into la la of the distant future of 1997, by the way, which I adore. [01:46:20] Speaker B: Amazing. [01:46:21] Speaker A: And you see just this kind of very idiosyncratic view of what if you draw on the threads of 1980, sorry, 1992 or 1993 or whatever it was made, and extrapolate. Okay. So with that as our starting point, this is what five years from now might look like. [01:46:42] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:46:43] Speaker A: With the news being fucked and, you know, the kind of the police state, gang violence. If you were to take a look at the early 90s, that's not a bad stab at where you might have guessed the future might be from that. [01:46:57] Speaker B: Yeah, sure. [01:46:58] Speaker A: Mm. But then it's, you know, you've got a super funny, super eccentric, really relentless. Like you said, that entire film, it pauses twice, like. And it's just set piece after set piece. [01:47:13] Speaker B: I think I told. Like, we were watching it and I said that. I was like, I think there's only been, like seven minutes of this movie that wasn't an action sequence. [01:47:21] Speaker A: Yeah, it doesn't. It doesn't let up at all. Because, I mean, I've seen Predator quite recently and it takes a long time to get where it goes, you know. Mm. It's a it. [01:47:29] Speaker B: Which this does in a way too. Like the first, you know, 45 minutes of it, there's like no Predator, really. Aside from occasionally you're seeing it kind of wavy move across things, you know, it doesn't. It doesn't get to that part. [01:47:42] Speaker A: But what there is is later on the. The feared fucking Jamaican Voodoo gang. [01:47:47] Speaker B: Yes, the Jamaican Voodoo. [01:47:48] Speaker A: What there is. [01:47:49] Speaker B: Yeah, of course. Yeah. [01:47:50] Speaker A: What there is is just. I can't find any involvement from Frank Miller in this film. Right. And I've looked. [01:47:59] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. [01:48:00] Speaker A: What you get is the most Frank Miller movie that Frank Miller never got near in, you know, all the way down to the depiction of women, the gang violence, the gunplay. That's the first kind of third of the movie. Just gang warfare and, you know, very colorful caricatures. [01:48:26] Speaker B: Yes. Oh, yeah. One liners. [01:48:29] Speaker A: One liners. [01:48:30] Speaker B: Memorable that, guys. [01:48:32] Speaker A: Yeah, Full of them. Absolutely full of them. Gary Busey is in there. Gary Busey. And I've got to pick you up on this, right? I've got to pick you up on this, friends. It's the first of March, and Corry is currently running two out of three on the Deadpool, right? [01:48:43] Speaker B: I am, yeah. That's true. [01:48:45] Speaker A: But I gotta tell you, if you get the first hat trick with the three that you've picked, it would be a sad day for the Deadpool, right, Because you are goal hanging, mate. You've picked Van Van Der Beek with advanced stage colorectal cancer. Right. [01:49:03] Speaker B: To be fair, we didn't know he was gonna die. But yeah, I did. I did pick. Well, because, you know, I have a hang up about like picking these people. So either it has to be someone that I'm like, it's kind of expected, so it's, I didn't kill them, or it has to be someone that, like, [01:49:18] Speaker A: who's number two, your guy from? [01:49:20] Speaker B: So then it was Eric Dane, als, which again, like, we didn't know. But I was like, it's als. People don't last like super long with that. So it'll be this year or next, realistically. [01:49:31] Speaker A: And then you pick Gary Busey, who himself is a survivor. [01:49:35] Speaker B: Is he a cancer survivor? [01:49:36] Speaker A: I believe so. [01:49:37] Speaker B: Oh, okay. I didn't know that. That was more of a. Like, I had recently seen a video of him just making goose noises and I was like, that guy could probably die. [01:49:47] Speaker A: Yeah, Cancer. Cinnamon. Nasal inverted papilloma. [01:49:52] Speaker B: Recently? [01:49:53] Speaker A: No, in 97. [01:49:55] Speaker B: Oh, okay, gotcha. Yeah, that was. That was less of a. Because I was like, the other two, I was like, I mean, there's a good chance and I won't feel like I killed them if they die. That's my hang up. I was like, he's had brain surgery. Well, yeah, so he had like head trauma, but he's lit. That was again, like 30 years ago. So, like, he's not as much of a. [01:50:16] Speaker A: Like, Oregon, you've got to put a curveball. [01:50:19] Speaker B: I think that is. I think that's plenty of curveball. He has lived for 30 plus years with cancer and brain damage. That guy's gonna be a hundred. [01:50:27] Speaker A: Fair enough. Anyway, but he's in Predator 2. As is Bill. [01:50:31] Speaker B: Yeah. Yes, Bill Paxton. Just humming it up. [01:50:35] Speaker A: Doing his thing. Doing his bit. [01:50:37] Speaker B: Doing his thing. Yes. [01:50:39] Speaker A: Great. [01:50:40] Speaker B: I love him so much. [01:50:42] Speaker A: It's got everything I love about Predator. It's got everything I love about 90s sci fi action cinema. It just. I was. I was delighted. I was delighted. What a franchise. [01:50:52] Speaker B: Indeed. Yeah, it's got. I think it's only got like one full miss in the whole franchise. [01:50:58] Speaker A: Predator, Predators and the Predator. I need to watch again. Very gray memories. Is that Thomas Jane one? Is that the shit one? [01:51:07] Speaker B: I think so. [01:51:08] Speaker A: I love Thomas Jane. Can I just say that? [01:51:11] Speaker B: Yeah, I met him once. He's a little bit of a surly. Surly Bastard. [01:51:17] Speaker A: I love him, though. [01:51:18] Speaker B: Yelling at his kid and stuff like that. I was like, oh, geez, yikes. He's in a bad mood. But yeah, I. I reference him in Arrested Development, like, at least monthly. [01:51:33] Speaker A: I love him on screen. I like Thomas Jane a great deal. [01:51:39] Speaker B: But, yeah, that's the highlights of a month in movies right there. That we managed to squeeze into like an hour and 15 minutes. [01:51:47] Speaker A: Jack of all Graves. Movie special. [01:51:50] Speaker B: Movie special. Gotta have those every now and again. [01:51:52] Speaker A: Gotta do it. Gotta do it. [01:51:53] Speaker B: Back to the roots. [01:51:54] Speaker A: Gotta do it. [01:51:55] Speaker B: When I asked you to do a podcast, I asked you if you wanted to do a horror podcast. [01:51:58] Speaker A: You did. You did. [01:52:00] Speaker B: We didn't do that. [01:52:01] Speaker A: That's an example of Scope creep right there. That's what that is. Were I a project manager. And spring is sprung. It's March 1st. It's St. David's Day. [01:52:10] Speaker B: It's, you know, a foot of snow outside. But, you know. [01:52:15] Speaker A: But what I'm saying is we got through the fucking. Another dark season. We did it. [01:52:20] Speaker B: That's true. This is your best dark season, I think, the entire time we've been doing this podcast. [01:52:25] Speaker A: Not bad, eh? Not bad. [01:52:27] Speaker B: Not too shabby. Let's keep it. Let's keep it going. Let's keep the energy we got. We got shit to plan. We're gonna see you guys soon. It's gonna be phenomenal. [01:52:36] Speaker A: Yes, it is. And once again, for one more week, thank you very much for rolling the dice on us, friends. Thanks for pressing play. Thanks for accompanying us on one more step down the floor fucking road. Have a great week and stay spooky.