Ep. 184: memorial day movie smash

[00:00:04] Speaker A: I have quite an interesting story that I don't think I've told you. But I mentioned Deborah Tully to you. [00:00:08] Speaker B: Deborah Tully? I don't think so. [00:00:10] Speaker A: Right, fine. Okay, we'll pause that, then. Unless you want it right now. Do you want it right now? [00:00:15] Speaker B: Is there a reason not to tell it to me right now? [00:00:17] Speaker A: Check this out. Okay. So, tangentially linked to what you said. Right, okay. I'm driving home from Bristol the other day, him and I've been driving for ages, and it was getting to the last, like, half an hour of the drive, and my phone goes, and it's a withheld number. Right, okay, which always means cold caller, which always means scam. You know what I mean? And I never usually answer those, but I was super bored and I thought, well, maybe it'll be, like, somebody from outbank contact center, and I can fuck with them a little bit, you know? So I answer the phone now, first detail to recall. They ask for me by name. Hello? Is that Mark Lewis? Okay, yes, it is. Who is this? I think I say something similar to that effect. Lady on the other end. British, non computer generated. Sounded like a lady speaking into a phone. [00:01:16] Speaker B: Right. [00:01:18] Speaker A: Hi, it's quite urgent. We're looking to get hold of Deborah Tully. Could you put her on, please? Could you pass the phone over to Deborah Tully? Sorry, I've never heard that name before in my life. She goes, okay, fine. Sorry, then. Bye. Okay, bye. [00:01:31] Speaker B: All right. [00:01:32] Speaker A: Okay, fast forward. Later that night. It's about 09:00 p.m. phone goes with her number. I'm like, don't normally get him this late. What's going on? Answer the phone. Hi, is that Mark Lewis? Yes. Yes, it is. Hi, uh, Mark, we're really, really trying to get ahold of Deborah Tully. Can you. Can. [00:01:52] Speaker B: You're getting the strangers? Is Tamra there? [00:01:57] Speaker A: Right. Twice. And I say to them again, look, this is the second time you've. You've called me today. I've never heard the name Deborah Tully before in my life. That's literally what I say. Because I'm really sorry. Okay, I'll take you off our notes here. Sorry, sorry. All the best. Good night. Fast forward ten minutes. Okay, I get a text message, which I'm gonna read to you, okay? Aye. Message for Deborah. Could you please get in contact ASAP? We are from the mental health team at HRI and have been trying to contact you. HRI is Huddersfield Royal Infirmary, a hospital in the north of England. [00:02:33] Speaker B: I know where Huddersfield is. [00:02:35] Speaker A: We are from the mental health team at Huddersfield Royal Infirmary. We've been trying to contact you. I ring the number on this text straight away. Hi, this is Mark Lewis. As soon as I say Mark Lewis, they go, oh, shit. Really? Sorry. We'll take you off. [00:02:46] Speaker B: Right, okay, so. [00:02:49] Speaker A: And that was the end of it. So what happened here, by the look of it, is Deborah Tully, who I've never fucking met or heard of in my life, in all of my days, not only as her, like, next of kin has given my name, but also my number. [00:03:10] Speaker B: Your number? Yeah. That's weird. [00:03:14] Speaker A: They asked for me by name. [00:03:16] Speaker B: Did you google her or anything? [00:03:18] Speaker A: I did. Nothing at all. Nothing. [00:03:19] Speaker B: Nothing. [00:03:20] Speaker A: Nothing that sticks out at all, huh? [00:03:23] Speaker B: Yeah, because that's so weird. It feels like. I mean, unless this is like some sort of very sophisticated scam, but, like, everything about that feels like it's like a real person. Yes, it does. [00:03:35] Speaker A: Yes, it does. And I rang the number back on the text and got the same woman. [00:03:38] Speaker B: Yeah. Got the same person. And like, that it would be your name and number, like. Cause it'd be like, oh, if it was just like a mark Lewis. [00:03:49] Speaker A: Yes, yes, yes, yes. And plus, I'm not in any directories, particularly not with that number. [00:03:53] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. That's bizarre. [00:03:56] Speaker A: Work that one out. [00:03:57] Speaker B: Yeah. And what's going on with Debra? I'm concerned for her. [00:04:01] Speaker A: Well, so. Well, yeah. Particularly if, you know, if a hospital is badly trying to get hold of you. [00:04:06] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:04:07] Speaker A: It's never to kind of give you a treat, is it? Or. [00:04:11] Speaker B: Right, but it's a mental institution. [00:04:13] Speaker A: But it's a mental. Or at least she's in the mental. [00:04:16] Speaker B: Health care, right, because. Huh. Yeah. Does she work there? Because obviously she's not the one who supposed to be in the institution. Right. [00:04:29] Speaker A: I don't see why not. Is she a patient of gonna wall? Has she? [00:04:32] Speaker B: I guess it just feels like. Because they didn't say, like, hey, you're Mark Lewis. Do you have any idea of the whereabouts of Deborah Tully? [00:04:44] Speaker A: They said they're asking to speak to her. [00:04:46] Speaker B: They're asking to speak to her. Like, they think some, like that doesn't sound like that's abnormal. It's like someone she knows maybe is in the institution or she works in the institution. I don't know. It's like there's no, like, logic to the whole situation. [00:05:01] Speaker A: But please, the way I've related to you there is exactly how it happened. Like, almost verbatim, what I said as well on these calls. [00:05:12] Speaker B: That's fascinating. I would owen, such a rabbit hole. [00:05:17] Speaker A: When the second call and when the text came in. Owen. One of them. Owen or Peter was sat right there. Incredible. [00:05:23] Speaker B: So weird. I want to know more. Be like texting back, like, like, just like. Could you give me an update when you find her? [00:05:31] Speaker A: Can you give me a little something about this Deborah? [00:05:34] Speaker B: I know I said I don't know her, but I actually. I just want to like, tell me if she's on. [00:05:38] Speaker A: What if I did? [00:05:39] Speaker B: Yeah, just need some, you know, closure to this situation. [00:05:44] Speaker A: Deborah Tully, Huddersfield. [00:05:47] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:05:50] Speaker A: Deborah Potts, Deborah Tully. [00:05:54] Speaker B: Does she even exist? Very interesting stuff like that. You know how there's like the scams now where like, they'll act like, you know, you've been kidnapped or whatever, they'll call your loved one and be. And like pretend they have someone screaming in the background or something like that, you know? [00:06:16] Speaker A: I actually had one of these the other day as well and I tried to keep. Keep them talking. Oh no, for real. Started half three on Sunday. Hi, mum, save this number. [00:06:28] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, yeah, I replied. [00:06:31] Speaker A: Okay, love scammer, where are you right now? You busy? I say, no, love, I'm just making lunch. You okay? Yes, thanks. If you've got a moment, I need a favorite. Me and Laura are talking about this by this point, so I say, I thought you were on your way here. The chicken is in the oven. Not yet. I've got something to pay for today, but I can't get into my online banking. Can you please do me a favor. [00:06:54] Speaker B: And pay for me? [00:06:55] Speaker A: You know what I mean? That's how that one goes. Yes. [00:06:59] Speaker B: I usually get the standard. Someone goes like, hey, I'm in town or whatever, and then it's like eventually they're like, oh, you say, sorry, wrong number, whatever, and then they're like, oh, haha. Well, you know. Do you live around here? What are you up for? [00:07:15] Speaker A: Yeah, sure, sure. [00:07:16] Speaker B: And I've known so many guys who claim like, oh, I totally knew it was a bot or whatever, but they like, I just wanted to see and like, you know, until it like sends them a picture and all that kind of stuff. I'm like, you are hoping for a random hookup. Don't. All day long, this is how they get you, because men will go on with it. They're like, maybe, maybe I'm gonna get a describing there. [00:07:39] Speaker A: I believe in scam terms is known as a pig butchering scam. [00:07:42] Speaker B: Pig butchering. [00:07:44] Speaker A: Yes, I get them often as well. The ones I get generally tend to come through WhatsApp. They will always begin with something innocuous, like a case of mistaken identity. Hi, Deborah, did you leave the photocopying on the machine like I asked? Call you later. And then I'll reply with, sorry, who? I don't know who you are. Oh, well, you seem like a nice person. [00:08:05] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. [00:08:06] Speaker A: Exactly. And then it'll. And then by all accounts, if you stay on the phone with them for a couple of days, texting, they'll tell you to invest in crypto. And there is a completely different app that you've never heard of, which doesn't exist. You'll see tiny returns until you invest more and more and more and more. And then they vanish. Pig butchering. That's what it's called now. [00:08:27] Speaker B: Keogh got, like, a weird one when we were in Spain, and it was, like our anniversary, and he got one. And this has happened to other people at his work. In fact, it happened the same night, but it's happened since, too. But he gets this message from a guy. He works with, this guy, Jay O'Connor. And he's like, oh, Jay messaged me. And he's asking where I'm at or whatever. And so he's talking to him and he's like, hey, like, I really need a favor. And all kinds of stuff, like these things fell through, blah, blah, blah. And, like. And then he asks him a scam that I think we've all heard before, the, like, you know, I need these gift cards, so can you do this? And then Kyo was like, then he's like, what? That sounds kind of weird. And so he asked him, hey, what's our per diem on this show? And, like, the guy, like, didn't have an answer or, like, answered wrong or something like that. Kate was like, okay, this is definitely a scam. But one of his co workers bought, like, did it. He bought the gift cards and, you know, was out this money as a result of it because it came from, like, when Kyo then went back and looked at the email address like, it was like it wasn't. It wasn't quite right. It wasn't like a spoofed thing, but it was like one letter off or something like that. [00:09:55] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, of course. Like a capital a instead of an l. Yeah, exactly. [00:09:59] Speaker B: One of those kinds of things. And it's like. But it's wild because it's like, how do they, like, they target a workplace like this? And, you know, they know who Kyo is and who Jay is and these kinds of things to be able to, like, work with cards. [00:10:15] Speaker A: Gift cards have been the currency of choice for scammers for decades. Yeah, right. And even though I consider myself quite dialed in, you know. Yeah, I. I've never quite understood how somebody else in a different country, potentially. What's the exit strategy with gift cards, then? How do you convert gift cards into cash? [00:10:38] Speaker B: I think you just sell them. [00:10:40] Speaker A: Is it really that rudimentary? [00:10:43] Speaker B: I think it's that rudimentary. You buy, someone buys a $100 iTunes. [00:10:48] Speaker A: It's only ever particular types of gift card as well. I couldn't buy, like, Argos gift card. They've got to be like, apple specifically. [00:10:54] Speaker B: It's always apple. Yeah. It's always itunes gift cards that you end up asked for. Yeah, I assume it's that they're easy to sell. You could sell them like, discounted or whatever. Oh, $75 for $100 iTunes. [00:11:07] Speaker A: I was looking for something more intricate. I was looking for something a bit more. [00:11:10] Speaker B: Yeah, I don't think it's that complicated. [00:11:12] Speaker A: More oceans twelve east? [00:11:14] Speaker B: No, I think they just scam you into buying something and then they sell it and disappoint. I know. Nobody's got any creativity anymore. [00:11:24] Speaker A: No, they don't. Um, hopefully Deborah Tully, however, and wherever she is, I hope she is engaged in creative, fruitful pursuits and as well, and sticking to her meds completely. [00:11:39] Speaker B: Should we dive in, do you think? Just go from. [00:11:42] Speaker A: I thought we had. [00:11:42] Speaker B: Yeah, I assume we had. [00:11:45] Speaker A: Let me quote directly from my notes, if I may. [00:11:48] Speaker B: Yes, please do. [00:11:49] Speaker A: Fuck it. Look at these nerds. Oh, mise en scene. [00:11:53] Speaker B: I don't think anyone has ever said mise en scene in such a horny way before. [00:11:57] Speaker A: The way I whispered the word sex. Cannibal, Rousseau. [00:11:59] Speaker B: Worst comes to worst, Mark, I'm willing to guillotine you for science. [00:12:03] Speaker A: Thank you. That's really, really sweet. It's cold outside, but my pancreas is talking to me. I'm fucking. I'm gonna leg it. [00:12:10] Speaker B: You know how I feel about that, Mark. [00:12:12] Speaker A: I think you feel great about it. [00:12:15] Speaker B: Today, Mark, on this year podcast, we are taking it easy because it is a holiday in both of our holiday. [00:12:24] Speaker A: As you quite rightly said. I don't think anyone's listening anyway. [00:12:27] Speaker B: Yeah, this is. I can. Like, when it comes to, like, holiday times, whether it's Christmas or Memorial Day or the 4 July or whatever else, there's always like a drop where it's like, nobody has time for this. No, but, like, everyone's got family shit going on, or they're. [00:12:43] Speaker A: Yes. [00:12:44] Speaker B: Hungover or whatever the case may be. And so we figured we'd like, take it easy. Low stakes. Nothing that anyone's going to feel a lot of pressure to listen to and just chill and talk about some stuff that we have watched. Because I think we both got quite a few things in this week. [00:13:01] Speaker A: We did. I pounded some in this week. [00:13:04] Speaker B: Yeah. Which is beautiful. [00:13:06] Speaker A: Yes. As both of my kids are away separately, and Laura nicked off for a couple of days with Owen. So I thought, fuck it. Let's go. Absolutely ham on the movies. And I squeezed in so many. And what I'm quite looking forward to is there's one movie that I squeezed in that you don't know about. I don't know yet. And I'm gonna. You got a 20 questions. [00:13:28] Speaker B: This is very funny. I don't know what got into you with this, but I'm excited to give it a whirl. I've been thinking about questions for the past two days or whatever to be able to get it. [00:13:42] Speaker A: You won't get it. [00:13:42] Speaker B: Wow. You know what? The other day, if you do, what were we watching? What? There's a movie. Oh, so we're watching Ministry of ungentlemanly warfare a couple weeks ago, right. And I think I've mentioned before that Keough is convinced that I'm what's called a super recognizer. We discussed this before, right? So, you know, I can pick people out as having seen them before pretty much anywhere, even if I don't necessarily remember where from. I don't really forget a face. And so as a result of this, I'm usually like, one of my little weird spiritual gifts is if I'm, like, watching something and someone looks like somebody else, I can be like that person looks like the halfway point between these two people. You know, things like that. Like, I can pick the features out and stuff like that of people like that. But. So we're watching Minnesota of ungentlemanly warfare. And I'm like, look at the guy playing Winston Churchill. And it's like, it doesn't look like anybody, really. It certainly doesn't look like Churchill either. But it was like one of those things. Kind of like Colin Farrell as the Penguin. Kind of like, who's in there? But Keough looks it up, and he's like, you would never in a million years guess who this is. And in my brain, I'm just going, it's Rory Kinnear. And he goes, it's Rory Kinnear. And I was like, it was. I knew that was who it was. [00:15:12] Speaker A: Good shit. [00:15:12] Speaker B: I can't pick out exactly why, but my brain knew something in there was Rory Kinnear. [00:15:21] Speaker A: It is an excellent skill. It is a really good skill to have. [00:15:23] Speaker B: It's an excellent little skill to have. I want to say on a movie note, since we're in movie zone here, yes. A little sort of, like, update situation. Okay. We talked a few weeks ago as well, maybe around the same time as the ministry of ungentlemanly warfare about my adventure going to see Richard Dreyfus and how completely unhinged that was. If you have not listened, I believe it was episode 181, and there's a timestamp in the description, and you can hear me recount the three hour hostage situation that was seeing Richard Dreyfus at Bergen Pack in New Jersey. But a couple days ago, John Latour texts me and he asks me about, when you saw Richard Dreyfus, did they do the movie first and then the Q and A or the Q and A and then the movie? And I was like, well, they did the movie and then the q and A. And he was like, oh, okay. Yeah, they did the q and A and then the movie here. And that seems to have reined him in, you know, an hour of Q and A, all that kind of stuff. And so he was, like, drinking, not on stage, but, yeah, let me. I will address that in a second. But so, like, he didn't mention anything crazy. It was like. It was definitely, like rambling old man shit, you know, or whatever, but, like, nothing crazy seemed pretty reined in or all that. They still had the same weird, like, videos that they played that had, like, barely anything to do with topic, same old lady moderating, who also is in space, all that stuff. But it was, like, reined in when he saw him. Apparently, the next day, Dreyfus goes to somewhere in mass. So for whatever reason, I'm not sure why. Maybe just because it was the halfway point between they were meeting Rob, between where they lived, but they went to New Hampshire the next day. He goes somewhere en masse, and this has blown up on the interwebs, because here we got to see full Richard Dreyfus in all of his unhinged glory. Now, when I saw him, one of the things that I was like, you know, for all the rambling here and everything, he is making zero sense. So, like, at times I thought he was going to start branching into, like, weird political stuff that was going to be, like, really fucking, right. Yeah, like, this is gonna get so bad. But then he couldn't make, like, a coherent thought enough to, like, actually say anything particularly offensive. But apparently he figured it out when he went to this one in Massachusetts where he came out on stage in a dress. [00:18:10] Speaker A: Is it trans kids? I bet it's trans kids, isn't it? [00:18:13] Speaker B: It's trans kids for sure. [00:18:14] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:18:16] Speaker B: What's an unhinged boomer gonna come out and talk about? Came out in a dress, which apparently he tried to take off himself. And then, according to Reddit, to, like, stagehands had to help him out of, which is just, like, deeply weird. And people were like, I don't know why he did this. Like, what this bit has to do with anything. They start going through the Q and A. He has this thing about Barbra Streisand, and I thought this was, like, spontaneous at our thing. But apparently he has a huge fucking grudge about Barbra Streisand that he has mentioned at every single one of these stops. They did a movie together, like, 37 years ago. You would think a guy would be able to let it go. But this time, you know, he had talked about basically, you know, Barbra Strei. Streisand, she's brilliant and all this kind of stuff, but she's like an idiot. And, you know, she's totally not ready to direct a movie or whatever. Like, that's kind of what he talked about at ours. He took it one further at this one and talked about how it's a problem with women. Women can't direct movies and women can't lead. That's the problem here. Women are too soft and they in charge of things, which is a take, for sure. [00:19:32] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:19:32] Speaker B: I don't know. [00:19:33] Speaker A: And then I'd have to think it through. [00:19:37] Speaker B: Yeah, let's, you know, don't make any, like, rash decisions about what you think of this. [00:19:42] Speaker A: No judgment on both sides. [00:19:45] Speaker B: But then, because this is how all transphobes are, they can't, like, they can't not talk about it. Completely unconnected to anything. He then had to go off about how, like, ten year olds shouldn't be able to decide all of a sudden that they can be a boy and, you know, all that stuff. And apparently this went so poorly because he's in, in Massachusetts, which is a very, like, I mean, you know, it has its conservatism, all that kind of stuff. But, like, overall, like, it's a quite liberal state, especially in the area he was in. And, like, the audience started booing and yelling at him and, you know, telling him he was supposed to be talking about jaws. And so he was like, oh, you're going to be one of those, like, ugly audiences, huh? And, like, people just walked out, like, apparently, like, dozens of people, straight left. People were asking for their money. [00:20:44] Speaker A: Oh, good. [00:20:45] Speaker B: Yeah, right. You know, it was just an absolute disaster. Unmitigated disaster. [00:20:55] Speaker A: Based on the rules, you can still enjoy jaws, but anything that he is. [00:20:58] Speaker B: In from now, which I don't think is a problem. [00:21:02] Speaker A: Exactly. [00:21:03] Speaker B: Like, I think he's recently in a movie with Gina Carano. There was not really, like, a risk that I was going to be like, damn, I really wanted to see that. But now I found out he's terrible. [00:21:15] Speaker A: Like, well, they wouldn't have had lots to talk about. [00:21:19] Speaker B: Yeah, right. I'm sure. Boy, that set must have just been so toxic. Just the conversations. Oof. Rough. [00:21:29] Speaker A: Yeah. I had such big hopes for Gina Carano. I thought she was gonna be here. [00:21:33] Speaker B: I know you were. Like, when we were watching what's it called, the first season of dungeons and dragons, Mandalorian. She's not in dungeons and dragons. [00:21:43] Speaker A: No, she isn't, but that's a different woman. I remain convinced that had Gina Carano not got the brain worms, she would have been invention of dragons. That role was meant for her. I'm convinced. [00:21:54] Speaker B: Yeah. Michelle Rodriguez also has brainworms. [00:21:56] Speaker A: Yes. [00:21:57] Speaker B: So, you know, that role was gonna go to some sort of unhinged broad no matter what happened. But what was I going to say? Oh, the drinking thing that you mentioned. So I was reading other threads and stuff like that from Reddit and everything, and someone posted a picture with him from 2019, I think, where he had gone on a similarly bananas rant. So they did the meet and greet for whatever this situation was. I think it was a con. And literally in the picture, he's, like, slumped down in his chair with them on either side with the most, like, disgruntled look on his face and mark full glass of wine in his hand. He couldn't put down the wine for a photo op. So, like, to be clear, this man is self described. This is not me assigning anything to him. He is bipolar, looks at it as a gift, and thus does not medicate, is totally boomer brained, and may or may not also have a substance abuse issue. So, friends, if you. You go see Richard Dreyfus from this point on, like, you just please. [00:23:11] Speaker A: That's on you, please tell us how it goes. [00:23:13] Speaker B: Like, everything here is pointing towards chaos, and you need to. To lean into that or just avoid it, I think. [00:23:23] Speaker A: Is. Is it. Is it kind of like a new development in his public Persona? Has he long been known as a crank? [00:23:29] Speaker B: I think. I mean, definitely for the past several years, he has had crank tendencies. And, I mean, here's the thing. So, like, he is, like, deeply mad about the play. The shark is broken, right? Because he was like, he felt that as he described it when I saw him. And someone made this stake of asking him about it. And I'm like, don't you read before you come here? He has talked at length about how much he hates this play, but he was like, it made me look childish. When I feel that I'm childlike, I'm like, given the events that have unfolded over the course of these Q and A's, I think childish is more appropriate. And I see why Robert Shaw hated him and other people seem to hate him. I think he's always been like this. It's just like, the platform is bigger now that social media exists and stuff like that, you know? [00:24:26] Speaker A: Okay, okay. [00:24:27] Speaker B: And that it's like, you're not supposed. [00:24:28] Speaker A: To talk lesson now, you know, with Jaws being as beloved as it is by so many, there are doubtless so many people walking around with a fucking Hooper tattoo, right? You know, straight up Hooper or Hopper? [00:24:42] Speaker B: Hooper. Matt Hooper. [00:24:44] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:24:44] Speaker B: Yep. [00:24:45] Speaker A: There you go. Stop playing with object lesson in why you never get tattoos of living celebrities. You don't do. [00:24:51] Speaker B: Exactly. You. You wait until everything that can possibly come out about everything's in the books has come out. I'm like, can I get a Jaws tattoo that's just Robert Shaw and Roy Scheider. Is that. Would that be weird? Can I, like, turn it into something else? [00:25:08] Speaker A: Jaws and Harry Potter. [00:25:10] Speaker B: I know, right? Seriously, I mean, there's nothing wrong with Jaws. Like, he's. It's a. It's a jerk. [00:25:16] Speaker A: Hey, he isn't dragging down the brand. He isn't dragging the Jaws brand down, exactly. [00:25:21] Speaker B: But they. Harry Potter. [00:25:22] Speaker A: Maybe if Spielberg came out as a. Was outed as. [00:25:25] Speaker B: Yeah, well, because that's the thing is that, like, my. Like, I would love, like, a Spielberg tattoo. Like, that's like, close encounters and, like, probably, like, thigh, you know, like that kind of situation, but, yeah, like, close encounters and Jaws and Jurassic park. Like, you know, like a cool Spielberg. [00:25:45] Speaker A: Listen, a Spielberg leg sleeve. I tell ya, I don't hate it at all. [00:25:51] Speaker B: Right? How fucking cool would that be if done right? I just have to avoid the Dreyfus in all of it. [00:25:58] Speaker A: So you've got. You've got five movies you can, let's say five. I don't know how big you're gonna go or what kind of real estate. [00:26:05] Speaker B: There is on your thigh. [00:26:06] Speaker A: I don't know. You've got to pick five Spielberg movies for your legs to even go. So. Jaws, close encounters, Jurassic park. [00:26:17] Speaker B: Oh boy. That's. Well, I feel like I was kind of going thematically there's. Because then I'm like. I don't know that other ones necessarily fit the vibe. I'm not a hugely. I don't really like Et. Et is not my thing. And I don't really like Indiana Jones. [00:26:36] Speaker A: I can imagine you not liking et. That scans. [00:26:40] Speaker B: Yeah, it's just. Yeah. It was a mix of like being, you know, being a kid and seeing something like that. I was like, it's very dark and it's very long. It is these two things together. It's like. I just remember being very sad watching it more than anything else. Yeah. [00:26:58] Speaker A: Remember. [00:26:58] Speaker B: I don't know what else would be like in the vicinity of those kinds of movies because he's made a lot of great movies. I just don't feel like they're all of the Sci-Fi or creature. [00:27:07] Speaker A: Ready player one for sure. [00:27:08] Speaker B: Yeah, sure. Can you imagine? It'd just be ip all up and down. Tintin. [00:27:15] Speaker A: I put Tintin in there. [00:27:17] Speaker B: Yeah. I don't know about that. [00:27:19] Speaker A: Just depends how far down the lake. [00:27:20] Speaker B: Yeah. There's too much racist Tintin for a black woman to put a Tintin tattoo. [00:27:24] Speaker A: Oh, there is, isn't it? Yeah. [00:27:25] Speaker B: Yeah. We went to. When I was in Portugal, we went to like a Tintin store. It had other things including some very kind of entertaining, like seventies porn magazines that they had in there. So it was like the. It was like tinted on the top shelf and then the lower shelf was just boobs. [00:27:42] Speaker A: Would it be the other way around? Surely. Well, boobs on the top shelf. [00:27:46] Speaker B: Well, it was more of a Tintin like place. They also had. What's that I see? What's the. There's like a Sci-Fi magazine that. And I think it's british and it's been around since like the seventies dialogue. No, you would absolutely know it if you saw it. But they had tons of that in SFX. No, no, no, no. I feel like it does like Sci-Fi and horror. I can't think what the name of it is. But anyway, it was an interesting place. But they had all this Tintin stuff and it being Portugal and not the US, it was not necessarily completely without its racism and things like that in it. So there were like all these. I sent. My friend John is like a huge Tintin fan and I sent him some racist Tintin postcards just for the fun of it. Like well, found these. Probably. Probably didn't find those when you went to the Tintin store in London, did you? [00:28:47] Speaker A: And because it's legitimate. It's not propaganda, it's art. [00:28:51] Speaker B: Right, exactly. [00:28:52] Speaker A: Just send that. [00:28:54] Speaker B: Precisely. So anyways, Richard Dreyfus, crazy. [00:29:00] Speaker A: Why were we talking about Agatha Christie recently? [00:29:02] Speaker B: Were we? [00:29:03] Speaker A: Ten Little Indians was on a bookshelf somewhere that we watched? [00:29:07] Speaker B: Was it. I don't remember this. [00:29:09] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:29:10] Speaker B: Was it me? [00:29:12] Speaker A: It was 100% you. We were watching a movie, and in, like, a kind of a deep cut visual character note, one of the lead characters had ten little Indians, and then there were none. [00:29:26] Speaker B: Yeah, I want to say, yeah, I don't think it was ten little Indians, but this does sound vaguely familiar now that you're mentioning it. We've watched a lot of things lately, so it's hard to keep up without many things we might have seen that. That would have been in. We watched humane. Was it this week? The loved ones? [00:29:47] Speaker A: It was either this week or last. It wouldn't have been Kong. It wouldn't have been Abigail. Was it inglourious bastards? And I don't know, and I can't remember why I wanted. I think I was talking about kind of race washed reputations of creators. A lot of Agatha Christie original stuff is vile. [00:30:05] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. It's like we. We are very good at just kind of like, pretending those don't exist, take them off the shelf, and just forget about it. It's fine. Just don't. [00:30:18] Speaker A: Like, every so often, whenever kind of roald Dahl. Whenever, like, a Roald Dahl property has. Has been given a new fucking screen treatment, inevitably somebody will post that fucking quote of his from the Twix. And if you have lovely thoughts, they will shine out of your face like sunshine, and you'll always look pretty or something fucking trite and shit like that. [00:30:40] Speaker B: Sure. [00:30:40] Speaker A: And every. I haven't done it yet, but every time I just want to reply to it with his quote about Nazis and Jews, you know, how. How does that not torpedo your career and your reputation as, was he not. [00:30:54] Speaker B: Was he one of. I sometimes get, like, him and Doctor Seuss confused. I know Doctor Seuss made a lot of racist against the japanese cartoons and stuff like that during World War Two. [00:31:05] Speaker A: Yeah, that rings a bell. [00:31:07] Speaker B: I feel like Roald Dahl maybe apologized or acknowledged this stuff later on in life, and I could be wrong again. This could just be because I'm confusing him with doctor Seuss. That doesn't make it okay when people just say, oops, sorry about that, but. [00:31:24] Speaker A: I do feel like have apologized. I mean, his. [00:31:28] Speaker B: I'll bet they have if they want movies. [00:31:30] Speaker A: His descendants have apologized. Yeah, yeah, yeah. When the fucking Netflix checks keep rolling in. But to my knowledge, he never apologized. [00:31:38] Speaker B: It was just. [00:31:38] Speaker A: No, no. [00:31:39] Speaker B: Just a regular old anti semite. [00:31:42] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:31:43] Speaker B: Cool, cool, cool, cool, cool. Yeah, it does put an. Well. And, like, here's the thing about Roald doll stuff, too, is that, like, when you read it with, like, any, like, everything sort of morality tales in his books, and they're all horrible. Like, every time, if you actually pay attention to, like, the message of any one of those stories, it's like, jesus Christ, this is upsetting. [00:32:09] Speaker A: So I don't want to disagree. It's been a while. [00:32:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:32:14] Speaker A: As you can imagine. But, yeah, I don't find that tough to believe. [00:32:19] Speaker B: Yeah. Like, he's certainly a standard white british male of a certain age, that's for sure. [00:32:28] Speaker A: Yeah. The soft spot the british culture still has for roald Dahl, I think, is more to do with how he kind of set himself apart at the time as being kind of like kids stories with the brakes off, almost kids. They spoke to kids as opposed to two kids through adults. Quite anarchic, quite graphic, quite edgy at the time. And I think that's where his reputation has been so beloved, comes from. As opposed to the quality of his stories, I think, is the fact that they were quite in your face. [00:33:09] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. I mean, I remember when I discovered him when I was fifth grade, being super into his stuff. It definitely. You know. And a kid isn't over analyzing the message behind a roald doll. [00:33:22] Speaker A: Well, exactly. [00:33:23] Speaker B: So, yeah, I enjoyed him at the time. Now, like, when I read things, I'm like, oh, yikes. [00:33:32] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, certainly not so good that it would balance out being an anti semite. [00:33:39] Speaker B: No, definitely not. He certainly has not reached. [00:33:42] Speaker A: You'd have to be brilliant. You'd have to write the best kid stories. [00:33:47] Speaker B: Yeah, I don't like to make up for that. Exactly. It would. Your kid stories would have to, like, solve world hunger for it to, like, balance out being an anti semite. So. Yeah. [00:33:59] Speaker A: And I don't think he got there. [00:34:01] Speaker B: I don't think he did that. I don't think he's earned that. So should we get into what we did watch this week, then? [00:34:11] Speaker A: We can do. Although at least one or two of these, I don't think we watch the same movie. [00:34:18] Speaker B: Is that. Well, yeah. Okay. Yeah. Because we watched a few things together. Yeah. Where do you want to start, do you think? [00:34:29] Speaker A: Where indeed? Well, okay. So during my and this was all pretty much on the weekend. I got around to. All you need is death. [00:34:39] Speaker B: Ah, yes. Beautiful. The irish independent horror film, folk horror film from Paul Duan. [00:34:48] Speaker A: Horror. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And look, I didn't love it as much as you did, sure. But it is a film of several gears. It is a film with several different kind of energy states up its sleeve. [00:35:05] Speaker B: Right. [00:35:05] Speaker A: Um, it is a movie that will swerve you. You know, what you think you're getting isn't necessarily what you're getting. [00:35:13] Speaker B: Right. [00:35:13] Speaker A: And I do enjoy that. I do enjoy the old seat being woo whipped out from under me from time to time. Mark, uh, you know, Mark enjoys that. Um, I suffered from not liking the lead. [00:35:27] Speaker B: That's totally fair. Yeah. [00:35:29] Speaker A: You know, just simply didn't like the lead. But, you know, more we. What we do need is more of this kind of thing. [00:35:37] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. And I mean, that's kind of like. I don't think we're that far off in our takes on it. I think my thing generally was like, I thought it was. It was cool and, you know, interesting and all that kind of stuff. It's not like my favorite movie I've ever seen. But I also was like, the swings, they are big. You know, the budget is small and the swings are big. And I think it's really effective at what it's doing with, you know, what it has. And. Yeah, it's something that I would like to see more of. [00:36:06] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. I mean, quite above and beyond anything that ends up on screen. It's a new idea. Right. You know, like a plot I've ever fucking heard of before. [00:36:16] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:36:17] Speaker A: Nothing else. It gets a big marco sums up to that. [00:36:22] Speaker B: So I still encourage everyone to watch. All you need is death and actually pay for it. Don't steal it. [00:36:29] Speaker A: Yes, and I'm delighted to report that. [00:36:30] Speaker B: That'S exactly what I did, which is a beautiful thing. [00:36:34] Speaker A: Like four pound 50 of my money off Apple tv. [00:36:37] Speaker B: Yeah. Whether you like it or not, it is worth your four pound 50. [00:36:41] Speaker A: That is important because your micro budget innovators of today are your fucking studio directors of tomorrow. [00:36:51] Speaker B: Exactly. [00:36:51] Speaker A: Why not support them now? It's like Giza who made a hole in the ground and then did evil Dead rise? [00:36:57] Speaker B: Right. [00:36:57] Speaker A: You know what I mean? Your small budget innovators of today are going to be fucking propping up your big franchise horror properties of tomorrow. [00:37:06] Speaker B: Pay for the ones that you want to see and. [00:37:09] Speaker A: Yes. [00:37:10] Speaker B: Not the ones you don't. [00:37:13] Speaker A: Yes, yes. In fact, pay for the ones you want to see and then steal one of the ones you don't. [00:37:20] Speaker B: Ooh, there we go. I feel great about that. [00:37:23] Speaker A: There you go. How about that? [00:37:24] Speaker B: Completely on board. Steal your Eli Roth movies and pay for your Paul Dewan movies. [00:37:30] Speaker A: Yes. Steal Blumhouse. Always thieve bloom house. [00:37:35] Speaker B: It's always fine to steal Blumhouse. [00:37:38] Speaker A: Never knowingly paid for Blumhouse, that's a fucking. [00:37:42] Speaker B: I do see a lot of those in the theater, though, so, you know. [00:37:46] Speaker A: I don't think I've ever paid to see a Bluehost movie that I. [00:37:48] Speaker B: That I surely you paid for. [00:37:50] Speaker A: Get it going in. [00:37:51] Speaker B: Oh, okay. Gotcha. [00:37:52] Speaker A: Yeah, I know. I think I did. You know, I don't believe I did. [00:37:58] Speaker B: Tut tut. But that's okay. He's doing all right. [00:38:02] Speaker A: No, I said I paid for us. I definitely paid for us. [00:38:05] Speaker B: There you go. I definitely went and saw both of those. [00:38:08] Speaker A: Absolved. [00:38:09] Speaker B: I saw. I saw both of those in the theater. And I saw. Nope. Three times in the theater, so bloom has to gotten bloody from me. Although it is no bloom house. I'm not sure. [00:38:20] Speaker A: Um. It's what? It's the one with the horse. [00:38:24] Speaker B: The one with the horse? Well, it's like the monkey's paw, which I think is Jordan Peele's company, but I don't know if Blumhouse is involved. [00:38:33] Speaker A: No, just universal. It doesn't say anything about Blue Mouse? Nope. Went straight to Netflix, didn't they? Over here? [00:38:40] Speaker B: Did it, like, at the same time it was released? [00:38:44] Speaker A: Uh, no, it can't have been released. [00:38:46] Speaker B: I was like, that's a shame, because that is such a good big screen movie. [00:38:50] Speaker A: No, I don't believe it was. [00:38:51] Speaker B: If they ever re release that, I will go see it three times again, even if I have to do it in the same day. [00:38:56] Speaker A: Yeah, good movie. Amazon listed as prime risk, lists it as cerebral erotic horror. [00:39:06] Speaker B: Erotic. [00:39:08] Speaker A: I mean, it's about siblings, don't get me wrong. Well, yeah, exactly. I shit you not. Cerebral serious erotic. [00:39:18] Speaker B: Listen, AI is getting out of control lately. [00:39:21] Speaker A: Very true, very true. [00:39:23] Speaker B: Good grief. What else? What's next? [00:39:28] Speaker A: What is next? Okay, well, we could talk about humane, if you like. [00:39:32] Speaker B: Sure, let's talk about humane. This is. This is a funny. So humane is a film by Caitlin Cronenberg, her debut. So the other child, I don't know how many children he has, actually. David Cronenberg. [00:39:46] Speaker A: Well, it's the third one making movies now. [00:39:49] Speaker B: There's Brandon. Yeah. [00:39:52] Speaker A: Dave the dad. The third movie making Cronenberg. [00:39:55] Speaker B: Not the third movie making the third child. Okay. Gotcha. Yeah, yeah. Second of his children making films. The premise here being that there is some sort of basically like climate catastrophe and government catastrophe, like an ecological event. Right, exactly. That basically makes it so the government decides that there needs to be population control in order to rein things in. And in order to do that, they are asking people to. They're using marks eugenics here. No, but they're asking people to voluntarily be euthanized and their families will receive pay if they euthanize themselves. So our story follows a wealthy family. [00:40:45] Speaker A: I'm starting to see why I rated this as highly as I did. I get it. Right. In fact, Britain is in the midst of debate in parliament on assisted dying. [00:40:56] Speaker B: Right. [00:40:59] Speaker A: And if and when labour get into power in a couple of weeks time, it's largely. It feels kind of expected that we'll have some kind of assisted dying reform. [00:41:09] Speaker B: That's nice. Yeah. We're nowhere near that. This is not really a movie about assisted dying, though. [00:41:18] Speaker A: No, it isn't. It isn't at all. It isn't at all. But, you know, it made me wonder if for the states, maybe there's a bit further you could go. It is like suggested dying, something you might consider suggested. You've got. Here's your bill, mister fucking Hacken. Fucking Dwight Hackenreicher or whatever your name is. Here's your medical bill. This is the charge. [00:41:43] Speaker B: American name, right? [00:41:45] Speaker A: Yeah. But I think for the states, maybe rather than suggested, rather than assisted, you could maybe build it into the consultation process. [00:41:53] Speaker B: That's basically how it works already. They just don't do it in the hospital. People just go home and do it. [00:41:59] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, but that's. [00:42:02] Speaker B: Yeah, the movie isn't really about like ethics of assisted suicide, eugenics for sure, and population control for sure, but not. Not necessarily about that. That's just sort of a, you know, part of this. But we come into a family who is surprised to find that someone in their family has chosen to do this. But when one decides not to, they still need a body and they have to determine which of those family members is going to volunteer themselves up to die. [00:42:36] Speaker A: No, this movie is currently poodling along at like 2.5 stars or similar on that. [00:42:45] Speaker B: I think it's even less than that. It's like 2.1, which I think is harsh. I don't. I didn't. I think your 4.5 is maybe colored by a couple of tins, but. [00:42:57] Speaker A: Well. Well, see, this is. [00:42:59] Speaker B: I don't think it's a 2.1. [00:43:00] Speaker A: Maybe I watched humane and it felt to me, imbued with the great work of the great canon of horror directors. Previous. Right, inhumane. I saw not only Cronenberg Sr's work, but also, as I was watching it, the fucking. The beautiful static cameras and the kind of the kitchen sink drama and the performances, it felt like it was drenched in, like, fucking Argento and Kubrick. I was like, this is a fucking working piece of work. And there was, like, meta textual stuff in there. She. You know, there were. There were bits about her relationship with her dad. You know, some of the dialogue later on, like how I've now evolved to outstrip the system. Da da da da da. There was a lot of kind of meta commentary on the nature of success in families was in there as well. And I was like, ah, I'm responding to this. I was really responding to it well. [00:44:06] Speaker B: And that is how you choose your rating system is. Did I, like, respond? [00:44:11] Speaker A: Fucking is. It is. So I ain't gonna back down. I'm not gonna edit that. I'm not gonna do it. [00:44:18] Speaker B: Listen, you're entitled to it. [00:44:19] Speaker A: I'm gonna be the outlier. I'm gonna be the outlier. [00:44:21] Speaker B: It's a little much, I think, like, with it. I mean, one of the problems with humane is there's no one to root for because you hate everyone so much. I mean, they're all terrible. [00:44:34] Speaker A: Yes. [00:44:34] Speaker B: And so that makes it a little difficult to sort of stick with these people for 90 minutes, you know? And it is just a 90 minutes movie, you know? But because you're not really rooting for them, it's like, that does make it a little difficult. I think it's, you know, Jay Baruchel. [00:44:51] Speaker A: Play a likable character challenge. [00:44:53] Speaker B: Right. I think when he plays. He's in a couple episodes of are you afraid of the dark when he was a kid that he's likable in. But, yeah, he. I don't know if it's his voice or what, but, like, he just has a douchey presence about him. [00:45:12] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:45:13] Speaker B: And it's fully out there in this one. I mean, he is just tough to watch. But it also then has, like, sort of a mid movie change in everybody all of a sudden that isn't really earned, where suddenly all the characters experience growth simultaneously. It doesn't really make sense. It's not the most unique premise. But I did tell you one of my favorite horror subgenres is dinner party. [00:45:47] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:45:48] Speaker B: I do enjoy. [00:45:49] Speaker A: And it does have that kind of the feast kind of that's. I respond also to intimacy and fucking letting performances do the talking. And I fucking this. I'm, I'm, yeah, I want to, if I'm going to edit my review, I'm going to give it five stars. [00:46:04] Speaker B: The parts are there, I think, is the thing, you know? And Enrico Colantoni is always amazing, and he's fant, he's the best part of this movie, in my opinion. Aside from Sandy Cohen, who just, like, ages like a fine wine, that man gets hotter and hotter by the day. But, like, I think it's like. [00:46:23] Speaker A: Don'T tell me that wasn't Billy Bob Thornton. [00:46:26] Speaker B: He is so much hotter than Billy. [00:46:28] Speaker A: Bob Thornton, the patriarch of the fact. [00:46:31] Speaker B: Peter Gallagher. Yeah. [00:46:33] Speaker A: Billy Bob Thornton in a wig. [00:46:36] Speaker B: No, not look it up like a. This is the Zach Braff thing all over again. I don't understand. [00:46:44] Speaker A: I'm the opposite of a super recognizer. I'm like, like a negere. [00:46:48] Speaker B: They all look the same. It's like hair colors as far as you can with the basic facial structure. No. Peter Gallagher, who is wonderful. But, yeah, I think all the parts are sort of, like, there. And I think that for a first movie, perfectly coromulant. And I think it's from here it's going to go up. But I think one of the things about it being kind of mediocre that I like is that it doesn't feel like it's resting on Cronenberg laurels, you know, like, it doesn't feel like a Nepo movie. [00:47:22] Speaker A: It's a Nepo movie. Yeah. [00:47:24] Speaker B: Like, this felt like she made it all on her own. The influence. Like Brandon Cronenberg. His movies are clearly Cronenberg movies. You know, like that he came from that family and you can see it. You wouldn't necessarily look at this and be like, oh, this has, like, strong influences. Upper father, except maybe sort of from, like, the more like the ones that I was saying a couple weeks ago that I liked, the more kind of character stories that he writes or that he directs. I mean, history of violence, thematically wise. [00:47:59] Speaker A: It had loads of dads hang ups in there. [00:48:03] Speaker B: Sure. Yeah. Daddy issues, for sure. But that doesn't necessarily mean it's about David Cronenberg, of course, and that could be made by any director who has daddy issues. So, you know, I think we know that, like, who her dad is, but that doesn't necessarily mean that, like, it's super shaped by you having to know that. You know what I mean? [00:48:25] Speaker A: Yes. Or maybe. Yeah, maybe an overpoweringly successful dad, right? [00:48:32] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, definitely. So, yeah, I think she's in there. I don't think that it has like a. It just doesn't give me that feeling of being like, yeah, okay, I get it. I know who your father is or whatever. [00:48:44] Speaker A: And I also exactly take what you mean about Brandon Cronenberg's films. Of his three, so far, too, have been instant fucking whoa, holy shit kind of experiences. [00:48:56] Speaker B: Right. And that's not necessarily a bad thing. Like, you know, if you want to take after what your dad's doing, that's great, that's cool. It's just like, you know, for sure, you know, you are getting something that feels Cronenbergian when you get something from those two. And this doesn't necessarily have that feel to it. So I kind of appreciate that it feels like its own thing and that I will watch whatever she does next. [00:49:20] Speaker A: Oh, listen, no doubt. Absolutely. No doubt at all. [00:49:25] Speaker B: What else? [00:49:28] Speaker A: All right, now you're going to enjoy talking about civil war again. [00:49:34] Speaker B: I didn't talk about it the first time. Managed to skip over it somehow, even though it was funny, because before we started that episode, I ranted to you and was like, just so angry about that movie and then somehow forgot to talk about it when we got to it. And then you were like, that's fine, I'm not going to watch it. And then you did. Now I'm going to watch it. [00:49:56] Speaker A: I think we paused on it because I was going to watch it. [00:49:59] Speaker B: No, you were like, that doesn't sound like I would be into it. Okay. But, yeah, go on with this one. Well, this one makes me ragey. [00:50:10] Speaker A: All right. And all I'm going to say is, look, there's a couple of things which I really, really enjoy in movies, right. Being places that I've been in movies. Right. Seeing those places get blown up. [00:50:22] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:50:24] Speaker A: Alex Garland. Really like him. [00:50:25] Speaker B: Sure. [00:50:26] Speaker A: Just. I just really fucking like his stuff. I don't think he's ever really missed for me. Nick Othman. Love. Kind of alt. Alt. Timeline movies. Love. [00:50:39] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:50:40] Speaker A: The end of the world. Living it. Love it. But what I don't like is white supremacy narratives. [00:50:50] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. Especially. [00:50:52] Speaker A: Which aren't recognized as such. Yeah. [00:50:56] Speaker B: Right. Yeah. This movie, you know, when. When men came out, a lot of people criticized that one for being like, very basic. Like, oh, did a man realize it's hard to be a woman? And I was like, yeah, no, I get that. That's valid. But also I think, like, it is interesting to see a man's take on that realization or whatever. And then after watching this, I think Alec Garland might be stupid. And it's starting to make me reevaluate on these things is I think he does great with tech narratives and stuff like that. But then this sort of, like, woke Alex Garland is not smart enough to be making the movies that he's making. And this one, I think, you know, I was talking to my husband, watched it yesterday, and also, you know, hated it. But we came out of it like, okay, just on a first, like, movie making level. It does, you know, it's pretty or whatever, has big explosions, all that kind of stuff. But it's a very bad movie storytelling wise. The idea of, like, not filling in any of the story and then having these very one dimensional characters who, like, talk in bursts of exposition, you know, is just lazy. The characters are unlikable, but I don't think it knows how unlikable it is. They are. I think it's a lazy movie when it comes to the actual script that is involved in this movie. [00:52:36] Speaker A: Kirsten Dunstan and mate, the two reporters I actually, I didn't hate at all. I did. I disliked the girl a great deal. [00:52:45] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, she's just transparently awful. [00:52:48] Speaker A: Yeah. Just this plucky young go getter of photographer. I thought I didn't connect with her one little bit. But I like Kirsten Dunst a great. [00:52:58] Speaker B: Deal, and I like her generally in this. She is a. Did you hit record at any point? [00:53:06] Speaker A: No. [00:53:10] Speaker B: Guess we're using the zoom audio today. [00:53:12] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:53:12] Speaker B: Yeah. But anyways, I like Kirsten Dutz generally. I think it does her a disservice to have her play such an entirely one dimensional character. [00:53:25] Speaker A: Flat, humorless. [00:53:26] Speaker B: Flat, humorless. And, like, to the. Like, everything about the characters was such a trope that, like, at one point, oh, my God, what is it that the. The black fella says to the girl? Like, something like, don't be such a hot shot. And I was like, come the fuck on. Like, it's like every, like, you know, plucky rookie cop with the grizzled old, you know, person who has to take her under her wing, you know, and doesn't want to do this, but she's forced to by the circumstance, you know? And it's like, I've seen this movie many, many times, usually done a lot. [00:54:04] Speaker A: Better than many times, many years ago. [00:54:08] Speaker B: Right? Yeah. Like, this is. This is an eighties story that we've got right here. We've all seen this movie. And so, like, just. It's a lazy movie all the way through on that. On that part. And then when it comes to, like, the politics, or lack thereof, in this movie. I equated it to, like, how Martin McDonagh, who I absolutely love, you know, he made three billboards, right? And he tried to take the same kind of humor that he used in, like, in bruges and stuff like that and bring it over here and, like, you know, dislikable people, but we empathize with them and things like that. But when those people are racist and you don't include the targets of their racism and you don't include the structures that created this society, you just have a racist movie. And that's what Alex Garland did with this one, is he thought, if I remove the politics from this, then I can kind of just, like, say whatever about journalism or whatever or about war or whatever the fuck he's trying to say. You know, I've seen a couple people say what? You know, Alex Garland is basically coasting off people watching the movie and making smarter meanings of it than he did. So people can make meanings of this that are something, but there isn't a meaning there. And throughout this movie, you've basically, like, all people of color die, like, period, for an undefined reason. Like, you know, we cut. We meet, like, a couple of asian fellas, and they're killed by a white supremacist, but, like, for. For what? You know, but who chooses not to kill the white guy with the thick accent who says he's from Florida. Like, you know, like what? Like, it seems like he's supposed to be anti immigrant, but he's not. He's just anti people. [00:56:08] Speaker A: It's very casual, isn't it? [00:56:09] Speaker B: You're. You lose your. Your black fella in a heroic self sacrifice. You know, you're, like, black. Like, people of color do not live in this movie, but it's unremarked upon in the movie. Why is this happening? What are, like. You know, the idea of, like, the states that have combined together in this don't make any sense to reality, but we're supposed to accept that. But you can't do that in America, because the reason that we have racist pockets and things like that are because of these legacies of structures. And the reasons that states are the way they are is because of the way this country, you know, was founded and, you know, why states were created, and you know, who the people were who were in charge and stuff like that. So you can't just be like, I'm just wiping that out. And some people are racist, and some people are not racist, and there's no rhyme or reason to it. And also, only white people can live. [00:57:07] Speaker A: Like you said about maybe crediting Alex Garland with too much in terms of intent, were I, to be charitable, I would ask, is he assuming a certain. Is he putting faith in his audience to know who the scumbags are without. [00:57:33] Speaker B: Needing to show a racist is a scum scumbag. Right? We know that. But you also, as the white director of this movie, have just killed off all the people of color in it. So why are you different from the guy who act, who in your movie does it? You know, and on top of this, like, it's this whole. The whole conceit of just imagine if this happened here with all us white people is a galling premise, especially with, like, you know, everything that happened in Rafa yesterday where there's, like, beheaded babies and things like that, like, actual brown people dying en masse in a war. And you're gonna go, I never thought about that till you put it in DC. Gosh, this is really. Isn't war bad, you guys? Look, what if. What if they blew up white people? This is crazy. You know, it's so fucking racist on its face. You know, the whole idea of, like, let's transplant a thing that is the reality for people in countries we have colonized all over the world and put it in our yard, and then now it's going to mean something to us, you know, now that we've put it where we live. Like, what? Fuck you. Seriously. Oh, it makes me so angry on every conceivable level to just have this guy come in with no knowledge of the place he's making a movie about with these complete, just colonizer narratives. Like, everything about it is, gross, gross. Gross to its very core. And, oh, my loathing is deep and wide. [00:59:22] Speaker A: Yeah, it's tough to argue, Corey. It's tough to. It's tough to come out swinging for civil war. [00:59:28] Speaker B: Yeah. You know, it's always like, I think, like, my husband grew up with a lot more, like, in his face racism than I did because, you know, he was one of, you know, basically three asian kids in the very white supremacist place he grew up, you know, and those other two asian kids were in his family. And so when he watches things like this, I often see, like, how affected he is by the treatment of asian characters in them. And so his sort of reaction to these two asian men who you're introduced to, who are introduced to as completely irresponsible dickheads, essentially, and then immediately murdered for being asian, that is a hurtful thing for an Asian who has experienced racism in America too. Watch. And who is that for? You don't have to tell Asians that this is what white people are like. Do we need to tell white people that this is what white people are like? What are you getting out of that? Who is learning from this? What do we get? Except war porn. Racism porn. It's just. Yeah, it makes me mad. And I hate civil war war porn. [01:00:44] Speaker A: Yeah, well put. [01:00:45] Speaker B: Yep. Anyways, what else did we watch? At least I got the rant out, you know? [01:00:52] Speaker A: Yeah, well done. Well done. [01:00:53] Speaker B: All the, all those weeks later, finally just get. [01:00:56] Speaker A: Okay, let's see. Thanks to a. Thanks for watchalong. I finally put off my list and, you know, it's fine. You know, it's fine. [01:01:08] Speaker B: It's a perfect watch along movie. It's. [01:01:11] Speaker A: Yes, it is. It is. There ain't much going on. No, there's Tim Curry being glorious. [01:01:18] Speaker B: Yes. Obviously doing the most indistinguishable, vaguely eastern european. [01:01:26] Speaker A: Eastern european. [01:01:27] Speaker B: Kind of like sometimes just abandoned altogether when it gets too hard to keep doing it. [01:01:34] Speaker A: Exactly. But chewing, chewing scenery. [01:01:37] Speaker B: Yes, it seems. What to do? [01:01:40] Speaker A: We have one of my favorite milfs ever, which is Lauralini. I can't remember it. [01:01:47] Speaker B: Yeah. Interesting. [01:01:50] Speaker A: So, so, so beautiful. [01:01:51] Speaker B: As I said during that, I associate her with like stressed out white women because of the characters that she plays. So I'm like, I get it. She is objectively beautiful. It's just because I associate her with stress. She doesn't hit the same high tension. Yeah, yeah, exactly. [01:02:07] Speaker A: Listen, you know how I enjoy a movie from like the dawn of the information age, right? [01:02:15] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:02:15] Speaker A: Right. And that's what we've got here. We've got a movie, right. On the cusp of kind of widespread Internet uptake. [01:02:24] Speaker B: Yes. [01:02:24] Speaker A: When you still have to hack the mainframe and you still have to kind of hit your fucking back door on the subnet to get your email through, right? And it's got fucking, you know, fold out satellite dishes and it's got palm pilots. [01:02:39] Speaker B: Yes. [01:02:40] Speaker A: You know what I mean? And it's got jacking in using your fucking, you know, your coax cord and you. It's. Yeah, it's got a lot of quaint. Hang on, is this computers, right. Kind of design to it and nobody. [01:02:55] Speaker B: At home knows so they can get away with whatever. [01:02:58] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. Exactly, exactly. Was it Kelly Rowland? It's like Kelly Rowland text. [01:03:01] Speaker B: Yeah, right. In the Excel spreadsheet. [01:03:03] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's that. And nobody else knew either. So. Hey, computers cool. Um, all over that. Absolutely. Love it. Um, but that's about it. I mean, again, if you want to. If you want. If you want to go looking for racism. [01:03:22] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, right. [01:03:23] Speaker A: You know, you don't got to look too hard in Congo. [01:03:25] Speaker B: No, absolutely not. Uh, yeah, even from, like, black characters, like the Winston. What is his actual name? [01:03:39] Speaker A: His name is Ernie Hudson. [01:03:40] Speaker B: Ernie Hudson, yeah. Even makes a pretty racist Africa joke in it during it. We mentioned this in the watch along chat, but the nineties had this deep fixation on the idea of african tribes and this backwards ness of Africa and all that kind of stuff, you know, that is very present in this movie, meeting the tribal people and their silly worship of the sun and things like that placed against those very modern american black people or the white folks in it. [01:04:21] Speaker A: I wonder how much of that Michael Jackson helped or hindered, because he. I seem to recall he had a big, kind of like an african american iconography, kind of tribal, kind of indigenous vibe for a long old while. [01:04:36] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:04:36] Speaker A: Black or white and earth song and shit. He. He went right into that. [01:04:40] Speaker B: Yeah. And then, like, in the nineties, like, even music really embraced kind of that, like, world music. [01:04:46] Speaker A: There you go. [01:04:46] Speaker B: You know, everything had chanting in it and stuff like that. Right. Sting. Like, you know, everybody was putting stuff in there. It's like, there's that song from the parent trap that you hear everywhere. Hey, I'm Mama. You know. [01:05:02] Speaker A: Yes, it was huge. [01:05:03] Speaker B: None of this me. That return to innocence by Enigma was, like, huge. So, I don't know, it was like, this strange. [01:05:10] Speaker A: Wasn't that moment. Oh, no, I'm thinking of sadness part one, also by Enigma. That was the monkey kind of chanty one, which is different to. [01:05:18] Speaker B: Yeah, it's different than the return to innocence is the. Hi. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that one. Yeah. I don't know, maybe it had something to do with, like, the booming of technology and things like that, that people, like, could have been getting smaller. Yeah. What if we got back to when we were, like, tribal, you know, and there's still people living like this all over the world, but mostly it, like, you know, that there's the sort of attempt at appreciation that was, of course, bordering on appropriation. And then there was stuff that just ended up deeply racist. Jungle to jungle and Crippendorf's tribe and, you know, all these kinds of things like that that were horrific. [01:06:03] Speaker A: Yeah. So. [01:06:04] Speaker B: Yeah, but Congo, you know, when you just kind of allow for that, it's. You know, it's a silly, absurd movie that you can't really be mad at when you're watching it. I mean, a gorilla smokes a cigarette and everyone acts like that makes perfect sense that it's the kind of. And drinks a martini. Yeah. [01:06:25] Speaker A: What will future generations obviously bother me to assume there will be future generations, but what will be our kind of ethnic jewelry? Tribal appropriationism in our art? What is our version of that? [01:06:39] Speaker B: That's such a funny question because. And I've kind of thought about this before, because obviously we live in a time that's like. Tries to be really conscious of that kind of stuff, and yet inevitably there's going to be stuff that people look back on and be like, fucking yikes. You know, because there's still. [01:06:56] Speaker A: I don't know about you, but I didn't notice at the time, but hang on, it's. Fucking movies and music have gone indigenous crazy. [01:07:05] Speaker B: What's going on? Yeah, yeah. [01:07:08] Speaker A: I was like, oh, tribes again. [01:07:10] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:07:11] Speaker A: So what would be ours, I wonder? [01:07:14] Speaker B: Yeah, that's a very good question. We've still got a lot of weird ableist shit to work through at this point. I feel like it's gonna be a lot of. A lot of that. A lot of fatphobia stuff. Still. That's a thing. Yeah. [01:07:26] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I guess the only way to tell is to live through it and look back, eh? [01:07:33] Speaker B: Exactly. So it's really 50 50 on whether we'll ever know. [01:07:37] Speaker A: Yeah. Right. So last movie I managed to squeak in, Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes, right? [01:07:45] Speaker B: Did that one today with Owen. It's a monkey movie. I'm sure there are people who are so annoyed that, like, we call, like, Congo and Kingdom of the planet the Apes. Monkey movies when, like, it's in the title. It's an apes. [01:07:55] Speaker A: What the fuck else are you gonna. [01:07:57] Speaker B: It's an ape. It's not a monkey. [01:07:59] Speaker A: Yes. [01:08:01] Speaker B: So I apologize to anyone who's been sitting there stewing as we say this, but go on. Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes. [01:08:08] Speaker A: So first thing, please, please, please address the titles of these movies and just getting all the. Because of the. Of the. Of the. Of the kind of format ain't fucking working, mate. [01:08:22] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:08:22] Speaker A: Kingdom of the Apes, War of the Apes, war for the apes. But of the. Of the apes. [01:08:27] Speaker B: Absolutely not. Nope, no points. [01:08:28] Speaker A: Send it back in. Don't like it. Now, I'm a big fan of this series, right. [01:08:33] Speaker B: I do know that, as you may. [01:08:34] Speaker A: Or may not know, a lot of people are. It's pretty popular and rightly so. Right. What they've done, you know, it's. It's an ip that could have. Could have had a kind of a will this do? Kind of good enough break even at the box office kind of attitude. But no, they're actual movies. It's an actual series. It's a really, really fucking solid, solid movies. This one is the toughest to get through. Um, and I don't know if. Is it that kind of thing of being asked to root hard for special effects the entire movie? [01:09:08] Speaker B: Because this is kind of why I've never really been able to watch these movies, period, is, you know, how I. [01:09:13] Speaker A: Am about, like, see another cartoons 1st 40 minutes. [01:09:16] Speaker B: Yeah, but it's just like, like I can't watch a movie that is all special effects monkeys. It's just simply. [01:09:23] Speaker A: That is what this is. Yeah, I mean, at least. At least with the last one, there were more humans, and then with the first two, there were plenty of humans. [01:09:33] Speaker B: Sure. Yeah. [01:09:33] Speaker A: With this one, there's like six humans and it's all cg monkeys. So maybe that's a barrier to empathy. For a start, all of the, you know, it's not that great a spoiler, but none of the cast from the first three survived into this. It's all new monkeys. [01:09:51] Speaker B: I didn't think so. [01:09:51] Speaker A: Yeah, all new monkeys. All new problems. All new. [01:09:56] Speaker B: More monkeys problems. [01:09:58] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. This, um. It gives me monkeys, this fucking movie. So, yeah, I found it. I found it. A bit of a stress to get through, to be honest. It. [01:10:11] Speaker B: How long is this movie? It feels like it'd be a long movie. [01:10:15] Speaker A: Um, I'll just do the research on that one for you, Corrigan. 145 minutes. [01:10:23] Speaker B: You know, that's a lot of monkey. [01:10:25] Speaker A: It's got a story to tell, and by God, it ain't gonna rush itself. Not for you, sir. [01:10:31] Speaker B: No, absolutely not. [01:10:32] Speaker A: I mean, look, there are worse movies, but war for the future of the Planet of the apes? Yeah, no. Fucking steal it off the Internet. [01:10:42] Speaker B: Fair enough. [01:10:44] Speaker A: I'd be smart about it were not for the fact that I used my free monthly cinema code from sky to take Owen. [01:10:50] Speaker B: Very nice. Yeah, that's a blessing. Yeah. Okay, now we went on. Well, I was kind of on an adventure, I suppose, here. A thematic adventure when it came to films. I went to the movies, of course, to see Furiosa naturally, and that sort of spawned, like, I had to rewatch Fury road after that. And then I texted you for one of our movie nights and was like, what do you think of watching the OG Mad Max? Because I literally, like, the last time I saw that, I was between the ages of seven and ten. I was very young. I know Mad Max was kind of a staple in our household when I was growing up, but I have not seen it in a very long time. So I was like, why don't we watch that? [01:11:41] Speaker A: As I said to you at the time, very surprising to hear you actually ask for a Mel Gibson film. [01:11:46] Speaker B: Yeah. Not a thing that happens a whole heck of a lot. Response to was, it's very old and you're going to steal it. So I feel pretty okay about watching that. And it's part of, you know, a little bit of a semi completionist situation, I will say. With Mad Max, with the OG, they were like bits and pieces I remembered of it. But it was interesting to watch this one, having watched the recent movies, because, like, it's interesting to see, like, the start of the dystopia, right? Like, you're seeing, like, the very beginnings of what we know, then turns into something, like, absolutely horrific and unrecognizable as our society. But in Mad Max, it's like, it's not that bad. It's like you've got some. [01:12:32] Speaker A: No, not at all. It's, you know, they've got shops and walls. [01:12:36] Speaker B: Yeah, right? You can live in your, like, cozy house and all that stuff, and you got some bad people roaming around taking advantage of the lawlessness of the situation and whatnot. But, like, you could live. It would be a little stressful, but your life wouldn't be that different. It's like I said to you, although you had fallen asleep by this point, honestly, this movie could just be Australia. [01:13:02] Speaker A: Oh, completely. It's like, really, like a reality tv show about, like, an australian suburb. [01:13:07] Speaker B: Right? Like just some outback craziness or whatever. Like, you know, it doesn't have, like, huge hallmarks of disease dystopia to it in this movie. And honestly, it's like, it's an okay movie. I was reading some other people's reviews of it because I noticed in modern eyes, looking at letterbox, most people give it around a three at this point. I was like, okay, so that's not just me. It's just kind of okay. But someone was talking about how the thing that you have to realize about Mad Max, it's one of those movies that pioneered a lot of stuff, especially with the action sequences that now we see all the time. And so looking at it now, you're like, okay, that's passable. But, like, then it was like, holy shit, I've never seen this on my screen before. [01:13:55] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, it felt more in the. Rather than it would influence stuff to come. It felt more like a product of its time being. More like. It felt more like a Roger Coleman fucking movie. [01:14:09] Speaker B: It does kind of have an element to it. Yeah. [01:14:12] Speaker A: You know, for sure, it felt more. All right. It went on to become a massive kind of cultural imprint. But I think at the time, it was just fucking video shop fodder, wasn't it? [01:14:23] Speaker B: Right, yeah, yeah. [01:14:25] Speaker A: It was of a genre as opposed to starting a genre. [01:14:28] Speaker B: Right, yeah. And I think when I think about it, I think probably the stuff that I remember, little bits of Thunderdome. And I think probably what I remember the most is road warrior. Because there are things that I'm like, why isn't this happening in here? And I think then I was looking at letterbox. I'm like, okay, road Warrior is the masterpiece of the first series of them. So I do want to get to maybe this week watching. Well, maybe not this week because I'm going away, but soon watching those other movies as well. Just. [01:15:01] Speaker A: I would certainly do two and three with you. Yes. [01:15:03] Speaker B: Okay, good. We'll do two and three and report back on that. But then, so, of course, you know, I rewatch Fury Road, which is a masterpiece. I mean, come on. I don't think I have to say a whole lot more. Probably everyone has seen it. [01:15:18] Speaker A: Yeah. Just one of those films that leaves you scratching your head. How did it get made? [01:15:23] Speaker B: Who. [01:15:24] Speaker A: How did this. [01:15:25] Speaker B: How does this, especially 30 years after the preceding films that this ended up being made is absolutely wild, but then is just an incredible movie on every level. And went to see Furiosa, which I think, you know, poor Furiosa suffers from following a perfect movie. And so, you know, it's not a perfect movie. It's not Fury road. For whatever reason, the effects aren't as good as fury roads. You're definitely very aware of the CGI in this movie in ways that, like, you know, I came home, I was like, do I just remember Fury Road? Wrong? You know, like, because it's been. I mean, I've seen it many times since, but, like, you know, at the time, maybe it looked good and didn't. And then I went home and watched it. I was like, no, the effects are definitely better in Fury Road than in Furiosa. And, you know, I was saying this to Sam. This isn't to spoil anything about this. Everything I'm saying is stuff you would glean from the trailers. But the thing about Fury Road, right, is it's a straightforward story when it comes down to it, you know, what has to happen in that movie kind of what her goals are, where the story is moving towards, where Furiosa is more convoluted. Because the thing is, we know we've seen what happens later on. Right. So you know that, like, Immortan Joe was not going to get killed in this movie because of the prequel. Right. You know that. You know, all those towns, Gastown and the Citadel and all that kind of stuff, like, are intact. You know that she's not going to go back to the green place because she hasn't been back when you see her in. In Fury Road. So, like, there's all these kinds of threads throughout this that you're like, I know where this goes. So what's happening here? What are we aiming towards? [01:17:31] Speaker A: Yeah, sure. [01:17:32] Speaker B: And so I think that it makes the movie a little more meandering than Fury Road is. And once you kind of lean into that, I think it works and everything, but you have to kind of recognize that it isn't, like, just a straight story, you know? [01:17:47] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, different. Different series, different story, different vibe, but same point. It's why there was absolutely no threat or any kind of real high stakes for something, like solo, for example. [01:18:01] Speaker B: Right. [01:18:02] Speaker A: You know full fucking well he's gonna be fine because you've seen another eight movies with him in. [01:18:07] Speaker B: Yeah, totally. [01:18:08] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:18:08] Speaker B: It's hard to make you sort of care, you know, when, you know. Yeah. At least the stakes of certain elements of this, there's no, like, we know she's not gonna die or anything like that. And I don't think it tries to, you know, it doesn't. Because of that, it doesn't make this mistake of trying to put her in peril that you think she's not going to live through or anything. And I appreciate that. Like, there's none of that stuff in it, but, yeah, it's a little more of a meandering movie than that. One of the things I love about it, though, and just about these films in general, is that they're, like, so intense and high stakes and, you know, there's, like, all this. All this, like. Yeah. And this. These deep stories in it and, you know, these messages about feminism and patriarchy and about, you know, ecological collapse and all kinds of stuff to do that. But then they're also, like, extremely immature. So then you have, like, his sons, whose names are, like, rictus erectus and scrotus, you know, so you just throw in shit like that that you're like, come on. Or, like, you know, the guy who has his nipples out with the little things hanging from him the whole time and stuff like that. [01:19:13] Speaker A: Like, you know, the universe. The Mad Max universe feels very 2000 ad to me in that sense. [01:19:21] Speaker B: Oh, for sure. Yeah. [01:19:23] Speaker A: Doesn't it, though? It's. Yeah, it's. It's. It's got that kind of british sense. [01:19:27] Speaker B: Of beauties or whatever they're called all over. [01:19:29] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Exactly. I get big 2000 ad vibes from. From the. That particular version of the end of the world. [01:19:38] Speaker B: Yeah. Which I'm sure would have influenced him. Absolutely right. Like, the first Mad Max is 79, and like, 2000 ad started in the late seventies. Right. So I'm sure that, you know, that's not coincidence, the similarities between the Mad Max universe and the 2000 ad universe. [01:19:59] Speaker A: No, not in the least. The more you think of it, the more there are. [01:20:03] Speaker B: Right. Yeah, absolutely. I'm sure that probably somewhere out there he's talked about that. I would be surprised if it hasn't come up. [01:20:09] Speaker A: I'm just doing a quick google to see if he's ever. [01:20:12] Speaker B: To see if he's ever spoken about it. Yeah, it'd be weird if he hasn't, but, yeah, I'm enjoying my little mad Max voyage and you and I can watch the other two to finish it out. [01:20:26] Speaker A: I would love that. [01:20:27] Speaker B: Beautiful. And then the other thing that I watched, before we get to our 20 questions, was Day of the Dead, which was a mistake. Not watching it wasn't a mistake, but on dead and lovely, they're doing Romero, where they were watching Land of the dead, but I read it wrong. Or maybe I read what I wanted to read and was like, great. I shall watch Day of the Dead in preparation for this episode. This is a movie I haven't seen since, I don't know, high school. [01:21:06] Speaker A: Really? [01:21:07] Speaker B: Yeah. Probably somewhere in that city. I could be wrong, but I would say high school. [01:21:12] Speaker A: I want to look at how you start it. But you know what? [01:21:14] Speaker B: Just tell me, how did I start? I think I gave it four. [01:21:19] Speaker A: Okay. [01:21:20] Speaker B: Yes. Yeah. No, I absolutely love it. And you know that, like, zombies are not necessarily my thing. I do have. I have plenty of exceptions, but, you know, it's not necessarily a thing. I love day of the dead. Of all the movies that. What? My special effects guy who did the effects. [01:21:45] Speaker A: Greg Nicotero? [01:21:46] Speaker B: No, no, no. He's in it, though. But no, it's the other one. [01:21:51] Speaker A: Stan Winston? [01:21:52] Speaker B: No, the guy. [01:21:56] Speaker A: Tom Savini. [01:21:57] Speaker B: Tom Savini. That's like. It's the obvious one. [01:22:00] Speaker A: Of course it is. [01:22:01] Speaker B: What? Of all the things Tom Savini has done. I think Day of the dead is the most. How the fuck did he do that of his movies? Like, there's parts where like, you know, I hate how gross zombie movies are, and yet I couldn't look away because I was trying to, like, parse out. [01:22:21] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. It's almost like. It's almost like a live magic trick, isn't it? Where the joints are, where the legs going in that particular model. Yeah, I completely agree. [01:22:32] Speaker B: When someone switches from a real face to mannequin, things like that, it's just so impressive on a practical effects level. And I think it holds up so well. If you changed the music and if you, like, remastered this, it would be like a movie that came out. Now. It's not cheesy. [01:22:57] Speaker A: Brilliant. Really great point. [01:22:58] Speaker B: Yeah, the acting in it is great. The characters are great, the storyline is at times moving. It's scary. It's all of these kinds of things. It's funny. Bub is hilarious, but also moving. Like, at times you find yourself tearing up over a zombie, you know? [01:23:24] Speaker A: So true. [01:23:25] Speaker B: It's just such an impressive movie on every level and also falls into the category of how, you know, I've been talking about how I think we have made villains too nuanced in 2024. And it's like, I really appreciate it when it's like, no, the villain is just like a bad guy and Rhodes is just fucking irredeemable as well as. [01:23:52] Speaker A: His whole crew, his little unit. Just all. Just the worst kind of shitheads. [01:23:58] Speaker B: Yeah. The absolute worst people from start to finish. I mean, you come in with them making rape jokes and all kinds of stuff like that. Like, there is no question these guys are terrible and earn every bit of pain that they receive by the end of this movie. [01:24:16] Speaker A: And, you know, the kind of the three top tier shitheads in this film, it saves their deaths for the last kind of. You are properly. You go through the wringer waiting for these fuckers to get chomped and then they really do. [01:24:32] Speaker B: And, yeah, they go in kind of the. The best, worst possible ways. [01:24:37] Speaker A: You know, you're right about. It has beautiful moments of introspection, doesn't it? When, you know, you just got a question, what the fuck was it all for? What was the point? Oh, yes. [01:24:49] Speaker B: It's such a stoner of the day of the dead. [01:24:51] Speaker A: I love it. I love it with all my heart. [01:24:53] Speaker B: Yeah. So day of the dead was a great watch. [01:24:57] Speaker A: Beautiful. [01:24:58] Speaker B: You know, I don't think that, like, I would say I think I liked it before. I mean, but I think this is one that to look at now I like even more than I did before. [01:25:10] Speaker A: Easily, easily. My favorite of that series. In fact, my second favorite of that series is the remake from 1990 of Night of the Living Dead. [01:25:19] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Which is great. It's a phenomenal movie. So much better than it has any right to be. But that was sabini too, right? Like, he directed that, didn't he? [01:25:28] Speaker A: Yes, he did. Yes, he fucking did. He's just been cast into terrifyer three, in fact. [01:25:33] Speaker B: Has he? [01:25:35] Speaker A: Yes, indeed. [01:25:35] Speaker B: Interesting. I am. I do. I am on the fence about that film. Obviously I'm going to see it, but terrifier two is a real mixed bag for me. So it's really. This is a make or break one for me, I think. [01:25:50] Speaker A: Yeah, I get it, I get it, I get it. The criticisms are all just right because it's a one man show, because he's fucking doing it all himself. He doesn't have any. And because he's made ridiculous untold profit with terrified. No one is going to be saying shit to him. [01:26:09] Speaker B: Exactly. Which I think is unfortunate because it works against him. [01:26:13] Speaker A: Exactly. [01:26:14] Speaker B: Oh, I have now budget beyond what I ever had, and it was super successful. So he probably could make better movies, but it's entirely on him because no one is going to. [01:26:28] Speaker A: But that is the one constant criticism about terrified two. It was half an hour too fucking long. I even said it myself. [01:26:35] Speaker B: Yeah. Like, there's really no denying that whether you liked it or not, it is too much movie. Yeah, it is a little indulgent. And so I just really hope that, like, he doesn't take that and go, well, fuck you, then. I'm making the movie, which is like, he's entitled to, of course, but I think he could. [01:26:54] Speaker A: I would respect either play. [01:26:56] Speaker B: Yeah, I just think, like, you should want your movies to be better. And so I hope he makes it better. [01:27:03] Speaker A: Make it longer. [01:27:06] Speaker B: That's just go full James Cameron on it. [01:27:09] Speaker A: Make it longer. Fuck them. [01:27:11] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:27:12] Speaker A: How much did your last movie make, pal? Yeah, fuck off. I'm gonna make half an hour longer. [01:27:16] Speaker B: The effect of the blur makes it look like it's blurring out my middle finger. [01:27:20] Speaker A: It does, actually. Zoom has my best interest at heart. Very nice. [01:27:27] Speaker B: Now, I guess I'm going to guess what you watched. [01:27:32] Speaker A: All right. An item purely for my own gratification out of just for no reason. I was on the sofa. I had a couple hours to kill until our movie that we were watching, and I happened across a movie on Netflix, and I hadn't seen ages so I pressed play and watched it. [01:27:50] Speaker B: And you have something that would be. Yeah, it's something that just as grounded. Something that would be on Netflix that you had seen before. It's not new to you and I would have heard of it. [01:28:01] Speaker A: Yes. [01:28:02] Speaker B: Okay, so there's our ground things. Is it horror? [01:28:06] Speaker A: No. [01:28:07] Speaker B: Okay, are you listening? Are you counting questions? [01:28:10] Speaker A: That was one. [01:28:13] Speaker B: Thank you. I almost lost track. I was just asking if before counting them. Okay, it's not a horror movie. Is it a comedy? [01:28:22] Speaker A: No. [01:28:24] Speaker B: Is it. I'm trying to go more specific than just like. Is it a drama? Is it a war movie? [01:28:36] Speaker A: No. These are great questions. [01:28:39] Speaker B: Is it a gangster movie? [01:28:42] Speaker A: No. Great questions. You're gonna zoom in. You're gonna zero in on it. [01:28:47] Speaker B: That's what I'm aiming for. Okay. Not war, not gangster, not horror. Oh, is it an. Is it an action movie? [01:28:57] Speaker A: No. [01:28:58] Speaker B: Fuck me. [01:29:00] Speaker A: Yeah, that's right. [01:29:03] Speaker B: Okay. Is it. All right, let's. Maybe I branch outside of drama. Is it from the eighties? [01:29:16] Speaker A: No. [01:29:18] Speaker B: Is it more recent than the eighties? [01:29:21] Speaker A: Yes. A seven. [01:29:25] Speaker B: Whew. Okay. [01:29:27] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:29:29] Speaker B: Um. [01:29:31] Speaker A: Oh, is she gonna do it? [01:29:34] Speaker B: Is it. Was it popular like a. Like a big movie? [01:29:42] Speaker A: Was it a box office smash? No. [01:29:45] Speaker B: Okay. All right. Is the main. Is it about centrally, one person? [01:30:06] Speaker A: It's one person's story, yes. But with, you know, other kind of notable characters within that. [01:30:14] Speaker B: Okay. But like, as opposed to like, you know, like a stand by me. That's like, you know, an ensemble is what it's focused on. [01:30:20] Speaker A: I'm with you, like about one. Chiefly about one guy. Yeah. [01:30:23] Speaker B: Okay, that's nice. About one guy. [01:30:27] Speaker A: One guy. Guy I have always used in a non gender specific sense. [01:30:33] Speaker B: Okay. It's about one guy. Is it about. Is a central part of this movie about falling in love? [01:30:53] Speaker A: No. Okay, that's ten. We're halfway through. [01:30:57] Speaker B: Halfway. All right. This is tough. It is. Okay. [01:31:05] Speaker A: I think you can do it. I think there's one or two questions that are just gonna blow. [01:31:08] Speaker B: Yeah, that would blow it out. Yeah. Is it about this man's family life? [01:31:16] Speaker A: No. [01:31:17] Speaker B: Okay. Okay. It's not action or horror or comedy. It's about one guy, not his family or his love life. Let's see, what else are movies about? This is where my tendency to only watch one genre I see is tricky. Is it about this person's special interest? [01:31:50] Speaker A: Yes. [01:31:51] Speaker B: Okay, that's twelve. Is it based on something else? Like a book or a comic book or something else? [01:32:06] Speaker A: That is an excellent question. Not in any notable sense. No. [01:32:10] Speaker B: Okay. What was the answer? It is about someone's special interest? [01:32:16] Speaker A: Very much so, yes. [01:32:21] Speaker B: Is it? Hmm. Oh, man. I have. How many more? [01:32:30] Speaker A: You have seven more questions. [01:32:31] Speaker B: Seven more questions. [01:32:33] Speaker A: Checks fingers. [01:32:36] Speaker B: Okay. Is, does this movie take place firmly in reality? [01:32:45] Speaker A: Yes. [01:32:46] Speaker B: Okay. Special interest of a guy, some other people around him in reality? [01:32:56] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:32:57] Speaker B: It's not about war. [01:32:59] Speaker A: No. [01:33:01] Speaker B: Does this guy invent or make something? [01:33:07] Speaker A: Great question. No. [01:33:10] Speaker B: Okay. [01:33:11] Speaker A: Not in, not, not in the way that you mean. [01:33:15] Speaker B: Sure. Wow. [01:33:22] Speaker A: Five to go. [01:33:23] Speaker B: Five more. Man, oh, man. What else are movies? [01:33:26] Speaker A: Would you like a clue? Let me see. Let me give you, let me see what I can do. I'm going to read you some quotes that got printed on the poster. [01:33:32] Speaker B: Oh, that's fun. [01:33:34] Speaker A: Okay, let me see. Collider called it a work of bravura filmmaking. [01:33:42] Speaker B: Okay. [01:33:45] Speaker A: Exhilarating is what Grantland had to say about it. Examiner.com said that this film will have audiences cheering and begging for an encore. [01:33:58] Speaker B: Wow. Okay. Interesting, exhilarating. [01:34:06] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:34:07] Speaker B: Cheering. [01:34:07] Speaker A: All of which are true, provocative and emotionally intense. [01:34:12] Speaker B: We are on this guy's side as he. I feel like there's like something like just at the edge of my mind that is like, not fully forming. Oh, man. Okay. Does he, is his special interest like a. Okay, think about this. Oh, man. Is. Oh, boy. I'm struggling because there's only five questions. This is, yeah, this is, yeah, I. [01:34:55] Speaker A: Can see the tension on your face. [01:34:56] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. I love to be able to guess things. Let's be real. [01:35:00] Speaker A: And I'm gonna start giving you more clues. The more questions. [01:35:03] Speaker B: It just feels like you've kind of maybe narrowed. This is something that's, like, outside of normally what I watch, and it's nothing. [01:35:12] Speaker A: That I would ever watch. [01:35:13] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Like, it's outside of, like, the scope of our normal things. And so it's like my brain is struggling to get out. [01:35:19] Speaker A: What if I said a quote here, calls it a muscular and accomplished work of kinetic cinema built around two tremendous acting performances. Wow. [01:35:29] Speaker B: Did you. Was muscular. [01:35:31] Speaker A: The word muscular was one of the words used to describe it, yes. Muscular and accomplished. [01:35:35] Speaker B: Uh, okay. Around two brilliant acting performances. Um. Oh, is it. [01:35:44] Speaker A: Oh. Oh. [01:35:49] Speaker B: Is the, interestingly, if this is what I think it might be, I almost asked a question that would have given it to me earlier. But is the main character from where I'm from what fate wise? [01:36:06] Speaker A: Yes. Yes. Well, I don't know. [01:36:09] Speaker B: Is he, what are his feelings on apples? That's my question here. [01:36:16] Speaker A: No, it isn't. It isn't. [01:36:17] Speaker B: Okay. It's not that one. [01:36:18] Speaker A: Okay. It is a good. Go hunting. No. [01:36:20] Speaker B: All right. I was, like. I was earlier gonna ask, is Robin Williams in it? That was my question. Okay. All right. So three to go. Three to go. I thought I had four. Okay. Okay. [01:36:35] Speaker A: I'll give you that one back. [01:36:37] Speaker B: I think it took me a really long time to come up with that question. Okay, so it's not that two performances make it cheer. Muscular is the interesting term to be using here. Okay. Wood. [01:36:55] Speaker A: The AV club called it meticulously precise and thrillingly volatile. [01:37:01] Speaker B: Volatile. Yeah, man. Oh, man. Is the. Oh, boy. Is there a mentorship situation in this? [01:37:15] Speaker A: Yes, there is. [01:37:17] Speaker B: Okay. [01:37:19] Speaker A: Oh, God. [01:37:23] Speaker B: Um, the mentor American. [01:37:35] Speaker A: Yes. [01:37:36] Speaker B: Okay. Here comes the balloon. Oh, no, don't celebrate now. I'm not getting it. It's a mentorship situation in a movie that could be described as muscular. And the acting performances are our powerhouse. It is not comedy. Action. [01:37:56] Speaker A: Billions of our listeners are shouting at their. [01:37:59] Speaker B: Do you think, is it like. I would be. [01:38:02] Speaker A: I would have got it. [01:38:02] Speaker B: Are you on the edge? [01:38:03] Speaker A: I would have got it on the edge of it. [01:38:06] Speaker B: Is it. And it wasn't made in the eighties. Oh, man. Okay. Is the central character an adult? [01:38:27] Speaker A: The central character is someone on the cusp of adults. [01:38:31] Speaker B: Okay. You would have watched a long time ago. It's my last. Last thing. Is this movie, um, movie with a mentor, someone on the cusp of adulthood. Muscular, powerhouse, american. [01:38:55] Speaker A: Only it's described the movie. [01:39:00] Speaker B: Oh, man. I don't. I don't know. And before I give up, just give me, like, a hint that will lead me there so I can at least have the satisfaction of guessing. [01:39:13] Speaker A: Okay, there are some more quotes on the movie. Post Av club calls it as thrillingly. As meticulously precise and thrillingly volatile as the music it celebrates. [01:39:27] Speaker B: The music it celebrates. [01:39:29] Speaker A: Hmm. [01:39:32] Speaker B: What. What year? Like, how recent are we talking? Is it the nineties? [01:39:37] Speaker A: 2014, I want to say. [01:39:39] Speaker B: Oh, I was thinking, like, a lot older than this. Just probably part of it. [01:39:45] Speaker A: It is, too. [01:39:45] Speaker B: The music it celebrates. Music. Someone on the cusp of. I don't. Give me another. [01:39:58] Speaker A: Music is the one really? [01:40:02] Speaker B: I have no idea. [01:40:03] Speaker A: Studying music. [01:40:07] Speaker B: It doesn't ring any bells. [01:40:08] Speaker A: Okay. I don't know why you ever would have, but you failed to guess. Whiplash. [01:40:14] Speaker B: You know what's really funny? [01:40:17] Speaker A: What? [01:40:18] Speaker B: We screened that at UCSB when it came out. I have a picture with Damien Chazelle and a signed script. [01:40:24] Speaker A: Shut up. You do not. [01:40:27] Speaker B: I do. I do have that. [01:40:29] Speaker A: Well, well, well. [01:40:30] Speaker B: It's so funny, but I just sort of forgot about it. [01:40:37] Speaker A: Blanked it out. What a great movie. [01:40:40] Speaker B: It was stressful that was a. Maybe that's part of it. Blocked it out. Mostly, though, I think I was most of those questions. It wasn't until the end that I asked if it was an adult. And I had been thinking the whole time of grown up, grown up. And I was thinking that this was probably like nineties. So I had thrown myself off with my own assumptions, but I didn't want to waste any questions. [01:41:03] Speaker A: There you go. [01:41:04] Speaker B: There you go. Interesting. Okay. So you watched Whiplash? [01:41:08] Speaker A: Yeah, I did. And what, you know, what a. What's the word? What a serendipitous fucking bit of doom scrolling that was. Watch fucking whiplash again. Story, you know, upon release. And just every. Every single quote on that poster is true. It is both muscular and meticulous. The performance is a superb. The dialogue. Fuck. Fuck. It is excoriating. It's got just the fucking malice and casual kind of cruelty in a lot of the dialogue in this film is just wonderful to behold. You see hints of the fucking tough love in this mentorship relationship, actually. Hang on. Is he doing the right thing? Is he bringing this kid into his own? Is he actually fucking making him worry he dreams of being? Or is he just day by day, brick by brick, disassembling this kid from the fucking psyche outward? Oh, it's wild. Love it. Great movie. [01:42:05] Speaker B: Amazing. Yeah, I haven't seen it since that screening. I remember liking it at the time, but feeling it was too stressful for a rewatch, so I. Yeah, things with, like, you know. Yeah, authority figures. [01:42:19] Speaker A: Like that is lots of close quarters shouting. [01:42:22] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. It's like all the. All of my, like, stressors in one movie, which is, you know, it's well done, you know, but, yeah, you're putting all the triggers in one place. It's a little much for me. [01:42:37] Speaker A: Friends get me next. What's your secret movie? [01:42:40] Speaker B: Ooh, yeah, this is next week. Secret movie. [01:42:44] Speaker A: At least. I mean, at least you were getting close. [01:42:46] Speaker B: I was, and you're right there, I'm sure. Sure. Because I was that close. People were absolutely yelling once I got, is there a mentor? I think people were probably like, ah. [01:42:57] Speaker A: I think I could make it to question 18 and still be like, does it have a dog? Is there a dog in it? [01:43:03] Speaker B: I could not get Robin Williams out of my head. So it was like, once good will hunting was out, and then I asked if there was a mentor, then I was like, it's a dead poet society. No, not everything has Robin Williams in it. [01:43:14] Speaker A: Aladdin? [01:43:15] Speaker B: Was it Aladdin? Is it patch Adams? I don't know. Um, dear friends, listen, we. We went in here, and we're like, we're just gonna talk a little bit about the movies and whatnot, but this is what happens when you put best friends on a podcast. [01:43:32] Speaker A: Yay. [01:43:34] Speaker B: You're my beef. Mark, my bff. [01:43:37] Speaker A: Yeah, man. [01:43:37] Speaker B: And, uh, shut up, because we just talk forever. So hopefully you enjoyed all of the little twisty tourneys that this took. Let us know your opinions on any of the flims we watched. If you watched anything good this week, since we're talking about movies. Hey, give us some wrecks that you saw. [01:43:58] Speaker A: Did you guess whiplash? [01:44:00] Speaker B: Did you guess whiplash? I really want to know if you guessed whiplash. Have you been scammed in weird ways? Do you know anything about the whereabouts of. What's her name? [01:44:09] Speaker A: Deborah fucking Turnbull? [01:44:11] Speaker B: Deborah Tully. I think it was Tully. Deborah Tully. [01:44:14] Speaker A: Because she knows me. [01:44:16] Speaker B: She knows. [01:44:16] Speaker A: No, definitely Tully. It was definitely Tully. It was Tully. Was definitely. [01:44:19] Speaker B: Are you fucking with Mark? Are you Deborah Tully? Please. [01:44:22] Speaker A: Are you Deborah Tully? [01:44:23] Speaker B: Let us know. And I'd love to know what the. [01:44:26] Speaker A: Fuck that was all about. Yeah, but stay. [01:44:28] Speaker B: One thing. Ha.